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linux_os2
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2025 8:46 pm    Post subject: genkernel still maintained? Reply with quote

Is genkernel still maintained?
if so where can an issue be opened?
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John R. Graham
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 02, 2025 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's still somewhat maintained, but clearly on the way to being deprecated. Notwithstanding, the place to open issues on all Gentoo-developed tools is bugs.gentoo.org.

You might also want to try describing your issue here on the Forums.

- John
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Ionen
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's barely on life support by gentoo's releng because they still rely on it last I know of, but their plans are to stop using it eventually (migrating does need work) and then there'll probably be no one left to care for it.

I'd really recommend to migrate away from it.
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Cruslan
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 11:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are the suggested option for compiling kernels from source rather than genkernel??
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szatox
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The basics are not going anywhere: make && make install

Genkernel probably will keep working for quite some time too, maintained or not.
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sam_
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cruslan wrote:
What are the suggested option for compiling kernels from source rather than genkernel??


Using distribution kernels (like gentoo-kernel) or building manually with just `make` indeed. Not using a halfway-house tool (genkernel).
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NichtDerHans
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Out of interest: Where does the Genoo kernel configuration come from?
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sam_
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The gentoo-kernel configuration is based on Fedora's with some bits on top. The intention is for it to default to something full-fat that'll "just work" on most hardware. You're free to customise it.

(I'll take the opportunity to clarify that genkernel never generated any sort of configuration and just had some bundled ancient default ones that haven't been refreshed in a very long time.)
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NichtDerHans
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I know, it was just for the sake of interest. I already had Fedora in the back of my mind somehow. I wasn't sure anymore.

I use the method “Using /etc/kernel/config.d” from https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Project:Distribution_Kernel#Modifying_kernel_configuration
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linux_os2
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 03, 2025 2:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ionen wrote:
It's barely on life support by gentoo's releng because they still rely on it last I know of, but their plans are to stop using it eventually (migrating does need work) and then there'll probably be no one left to care for it.

I'd really recommend to migrate away from it.

Yes already working with installkernel.
my configuration has fake-raid for root partition (no separate boot partition).
Tried dracut: had to put "rd.auto" as kernel-parameter.
tried the ugrd way: no sucses: raid is destroyed see https://github.com/desultory/ugrd/issues/225

booted with the iniramfs created the

Genkernel way: extra /dev/entries made for the riad-members
look for /dev/sddx and /dev/sdex entries
https://bpa.st/JRNQ
also the entries for /dev/sdd and /dev/sde (the ssd's itself) are missing.

Dracut way:
https://bpa.st/TRWA
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mark4
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ionen wrote:
It's barely on life support by gentoo's releng because they still rely on it last I know of, but their plans are to stop using it eventually (migrating does need work) and then there'll probably be no one left to care for it.

I'd really recommend to migrate away from it.


There was a time where Genkernel was in limbo, not working and not maintained and for that entire time i was incapable of creating a bootalbe system. Genkernel is going to need an alternative replacement just just an rm -rf *

Either that or gentoo is going to have to have special "one size fits all" binary kernel releases that the experts maintain.

At least with genkernel we can say "I enabled xyzzy in --menuconfig and my gizmo isnt working" and get help.

You want to spend the next 10 hours holding my hand walking me through every single minor detail for my entire kernel build making sure perform all those things that genkernel has just done for me for the past 28475689238745962349 years?

I think running gentoo with canned kernels would negate the ENTIRE REASON I run gentoo. I think a lack of genkernel would do the same.
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zen_desu
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 12:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dist-kernel provides a config that works on _most_ systems, if it does not, you can provide kernel .config patches to it. If you haven't tried it, I think it's seriously worth a try. The -bin variant is more or less the same but doesn't require compiling. The default config for gentoo-kernel is rather "bloated" but it should be very compatible, and most "bloat" is in modules. This mostly means it can take quite some time to compile.

dist-kernel supports using ugrd and dracut. Both options should work ootb with little to no config. I think it's good that the initramfs generator is somewhat separated from kernel config, but it should be able to check that certain required modules are enabled if the image is built for a specific kernel.

That config may be "canned" but it lets you edit it. You can even use "savedconfig" and provide the entire kernel config, allowing portage to automate using that and installing it, etc.
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mark4
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 12:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

szatox wrote:
Fortunately, you can still use make && make install. And there are special targets like defconfig and (all|local)(yes|mod)config, for creating either versatile or tailored kernels, depending on your preferences, quickly.

Still, it is quite funny that we're kinda going around the circle and arriving back at the starting point.


Yes i can just cd /usr/src/linux and make xyzconfig and make bzwhatitcalled and then do obfuscated dracut command -f -y3 -q12345 and after a month of trying EXACTLY THAT end up with not one single bootable image. not one lol.
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Hu
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 12:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dracut is not required. I have for years built systems with an initramfs and not used dracut to do it. Perhaps dracut is convenient, but it is not needed.

As to your other complaint, I am a bit confused. You are older than the planet itself, and still have not learned how to build a kernel on your own - which is fine, if you want to rely on a curated configuration that someone else asserts will work on common hardware. You want genkernel to keep providing guidance, which is fine. You don't want to use a canned kernel - with its curated configuration - because that negates the reason you run Gentoo. Which is it? Do you want someone doing the work of curating a kernel for you, or do you want to roll your own? If you want it curated, why is genkernel good and a Gentoo dist-kernel bad? If you want to roll your own, why are you using genkernel?

Using menuconfig is part of the base kernel build. Genkernel exposes an option to let you use that interface, but if you want to roll your own, you are welcome to use menuconfig without going through genkernel to get there.
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zen_desu
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 1:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

dist-kernel doesn't require using an initramfs, but using one may be more reliable, especially if you do not intend to adjust kernel config. An easy example is the "nvme" kmod which is not builtin so basically makes an initramfs required unless (simple) kernel config adjustments are made. I think something like dracut expects you have a variety of kmods built unless using hostonly, and won't really check you have ones for the system building it. This can make it easy to have issues booting with dracut if using a custom or modified kernel without paying close attention.

mark4 wrote:
szatox wrote:
Fortunately, you can still use make && make install. And there are special targets like defconfig and (all|local)(yes|mod)config, for creating either versatile or tailored kernels, depending on your preferences, quickly.

Still, it is quite funny that we're kinda going around the circle and arriving back at the starting point.


Yes i can just cd /usr/src/linux and make xyzconfig and make bzwhatitcalled and then do obfuscated dracut command -f -y3 -q12345 and after a month of trying EXACTLY THAT end up with not one single bootable image. not one lol.


Dracut can work well, especially with a kernel providing "too many" modules, but it won't do much to tell you if modules are missing. ugrd makes attempts to ensure many kmods, especially storage/fs related ones, are builtin or pulled as modules and will warn you if they are not. It's designed to be a bit of a middle-ground where it doesn't help you configure the kernel directly, but does some sanity checks like "is using a nvme, so should need the nvme module; is using btrfs so should need the btrfs module". If you're having issues with the kernel not booting, ugrd should be able to detect a variety of missing kmods. if it doesn't, open an issue for it, so that case can be added.
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 1:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mark4 wrote:
Yes i can just cd /usr/src/linux and make xyzconfig and make bzwhatitcalled and then do obfuscated dracut command -f -y3 -q12345 and after a month of trying EXACTLY THAT end up with not one single bootable image. not one lol.

So, I guess, my comments in https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1172228-highlight-.html has not helped? Unfortunately, I have not received a reply. It's difficult to help when suddenly nothing comes back.
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mark4
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

pietinger wrote:
mark4 wrote:
Yes i can just cd /usr/src/linux and make xyzconfig and make bzwhatitcalled and then do obfuscated dracut command -f -y3 -q12345 and after a month of trying EXACTLY THAT end up with not one single bootable image. not one lol.

So, I guess, my comments in https://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-1172228-highlight-.html has not helped? Unfortunately, I have not received a reply. It's difficult to help when suddenly nothing comes back.


I got cought up with work and was not able to get back here, yesterday I lterally did a quick search for this and found nothing, I also searched for "my posts" and the results were 100% empty - glad you found me though lol.

I did do the suggested modifications and it improved things, i still get absolutely NO movement of the pointer if my finger moves slowly which makes it almost impossible to hit that x at the top right of a window.

Since your suggestions i have upgraded the kernel a few times and due to other hardware frustrations ive deleted all saved configs and started over numerous times. I cant get the pointer to work properly as stated here and I also cant get audio to work at all through the spakers.
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mark4
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2025 1:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hu wrote:
Dracut is not required. I have for years built systems with an initramfs and not used dracut to do it. Perhaps dracut is convenient, but it is not needed.

As to your other complaint, I am a bit confused. You are older than the planet itself, and still have not learned how to build a kernel on your own - which is fine, if you want to rely on a curated configuration that someone else asserts will work on common hardware. You want genkernel to keep providing guidance, which is fine. You don't want to use a canned kernel - with its curated configuration - because that negates the reason you run Gentoo. Which is it? Do you want someone doing the work of curating a kernel for you, or do you want to roll your own? If you want it curated, why is genkernel good and a Gentoo dist-kernel bad? If you want to roll your own, why are you using genkernel?

Using menuconfig is part of the base kernel build. Genkernel exposes an option to let you use that interface, but if you want to roll your own, you are welcome to use menuconfig without going through genkernel to get there.


I wont run a kernel without an initramfs and ***EVER*** time I have tried to create one with tools other than genkernel I get a non bootable system. This is very similar to when I tried to create a firewall, i could only get two modes of operation... 1: block all packets to or from anywyere or 2: allow all packets to or from anywhere.

There are some things Im quite good at, others im completely and utterly lost.
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