Should OTW return?

mrbassie · Posted: Thu May 02, 2024 5:17 pm Post subject: Should OTW return?

Answers in sentences only.
No conferring, no eating, no cheating, no looking out of windows, no slang, no slide rules.
Use text(?) only, via a keyboard if possible.
You may use dividers but not on eachother.
No'one, you're in charge.

EDIT: added a couple on a whim to make it more equitable.

EDIT the second: to make they more equitable.

Hmm, I was sure I put the Frog Jenkins poll option in.
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turtles · Veteran Joined: 31 Dec 2004 Posts: 1696

OTW is some real Gentoo history the top polls in 2003 were electric bikes and lesbian sex both of which are more widely adopted now so as usual Gentoo was ahead of the times
I herd cokehabit got clean but still drinks club mate.
It was strange that OTW20.com suddenly went off the air, that seemed like a more promising idea.
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kimchi_sg · Advocate Joined: 26 Nov 2004 Posts: 3038

no because it will turn incendiary real quick.

eccerr0r · Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 12:56 pm Post subject:

Did most of the people who mostly/only posted on OTW/OTW20 are no longer active on FGO?

There's a lot of people who I used to "see" but no longer do after OTW went away seeming to imply the above...
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szatox · Advocate Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3432

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turtles · Veteran Joined: 31 Dec 2004 Posts: 1696

Zucca · Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 5:26 pm Post subject:

I think OTW was closed because:

Politics ruin everything
A nightmare to moderate

So basically because we can't be civil.
But, well, you can try to blame RedHat/IBM for its closure if you want. ;)
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saellaven · l33t Joined: 23 Jul 2006 Posts: 654

kgdrenefort · Posted: Fri May 03, 2024 7:48 pm Post subject:

szatox · Advocate Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3432

Politics ruin everything - that's arguable, even I have a bunch of friends literally on the opposite end of the spectrum. It's not as big deal as burgerboys would have us believe. Don't ask my salary though :lol:

A nightmare to moderate - that misses the point of this subforum, doesn't it? Just leave it unmoderated, this approach should be fine for "everything goes" corner. One thing that could have been done differently is hiding it from guests. That webarchive link to old OTW suggests it was publicly available; setting it to private would make it far lower profile.

Hu · Administrator Joined: 06 Mar 2007 Posts: 22657

The moderation team did follow a fairly light touch with Off The Wall. Eventually, certain people (who shall remain nameless as I honestly do not recall who it was, and I am not inclined to try to research it now) felt the level of moderation was inadequate and pushed for it to be closed. I think the idea of restricting it to authenticated users was discussed as an alternative back then, but closure was what happened instead.

NeddySeagoon · Posted: Sat May 04, 2024 1:24 pm Post subject:

turtles,

mrbassie · Posted: Sat May 04, 2024 9:27 pm Post subject:

Whats's the issue with talking about politics or sports or indeed the politics within sports or the sport of politics or how to be sporting in politics or how to be politically sporting or sportingly political or politically sportsmanlike or sportsmanly political and so on.

God I hate football.
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eccerr0r · Posted: Sat May 04, 2024 10:46 pm Post subject:

It's the offensive speech some people use to belittle people who do not agree with their opinion whether it be sports, politics, or religion.

Then this speech is reflective of the site owner because the site owner should have full rights to prune whatever they want.

Offensive speech will generally turn people away from the website. Not everyone but a lot of people because the precipitous drop of the signal to noise ratio.

I didn't bother voting. I just vote with my website clicks. So it's up to the website owners who have the choice to attract people who write offensive speech or people who are willing to help others run Linux...
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szatox · Advocate Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3432

eccerr0r · Posted: Sun May 05, 2024 12:36 am Post subject:

Since OTW was shown to everyone at first whether you had an account or not, this was a problem, so one who sees this garbage could end up discounting the site as something that one wants to be a member of. I know of some other sites that allowed political speech but hid it from both anonymous view as well as new members, so one needs to be a member for a while before they are exposed to it. This was to prevent bots from creating an account and indexing it, which may be a viable option.

I don't know why I deleted the section about network versus website. Networks (which includes phone companies), because they don't have a visible front that third parties could change their websites should never filter. I haven't totally decided on DNS which could lay on both but that's probably more of a directory service, likewise search engines. And too bad for companies that try to grow so big to do both, once you become both that company needs to deal with this problem? Don't want to? Split and divest, we don't want monopolies anyway.

I don't know why people say life isn't zero sum. There's a LOT of things that are zero sum because there are no simple alternatives.
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Zucca · Posted: Sun May 05, 2024 7:44 am Post subject:

kgdrenefort · Posted: Sun May 05, 2024 8:15 am Post subject:

Hello,

I voted «no».

I was not aware of OTW before this topic, but from what I read here and elsewhere, please don't !

A Gentoo, or any-linux distro, or any OS, forums should not host such talking.

Religion, politics and such are too border-line. Way too much. If only everyone or almost was able to keep talking without getting mad, trolling or run a flame-war, it would be ok.

We all know what will happens, at best the moderator would have a lot of useless works. Worst is giving a terrible, bad, image of the Gentoo community.

We don't need to be edgy, really.

I'll simply ask this question to the partisan of the reborn of OTW: Why don't you simply install your own, self-hosted or what ever, then doing your own kind of moderation ? Why it has to be related to Gentoo, somehow ? If you want to speak with Gentoo users in these context, make you own "club", IRC channel, forum, etc. It has not to be connected to the core of the Gentoo community, please !

First, less than a year ago while I started to talk here and on IRC, I was a bit frustrated: You can't even swear, or merely, since this has to be open to "family", aka persons too sensible for such subject or did not wanting to have unrelated Gentoo discussion, too much.

Now, I think this is perfect as it is: It's a good way to decrease flame-war. These are just a waste of time, energy, gives a very very bad image from the outside to new comer.

OTW isn't, in my opinion, related to Gentoo's «freedom of choice», it's a technical point of view as it: "Gentoo is suitable for power-users needing an «à la carte» distribution", that is not relevant to say Gentoo's about choice (in the context of community), just a lie.

Moderators / Admins are, indeed, masters here. We are no slave, simply, it's like a semi-private club, you can get trowed out if you don't behave, but the entry into this club is free of charge. You want to stay in that club ? Fine. Behave, follow the rules, suggest if you think you have a neat idea and accept if the masters are not willing too. That's it.

Regards,
GASPARD DE RENEFORT Kévin
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szatox · Advocate Joined: 27 Aug 2013 Posts: 3432

NeddySeagoon · Posted: Sun May 05, 2024 4:01 pm Post subject:

szatox,

Leonardo.b · Guru Joined: 10 Oct 2020 Posts: 308

I think "Off The Wall" chat should stay on its own domain, to avoid pointless discussions, and to ensure it stays free from censorship and contente moderation.
I liked OTW20 a lot, and I was sad when it went down.

On OTW20 we had enough minds to project, build and shoot a rocket on the moon... maybe in three days.
I'm surprised nobody did set up anything yet.
What's up?

pietinger · Posted: Sun May 05, 2024 9:19 pm Post subject:

I also read in OTW ... there were some interesting discussions ... but also very rude manners. Nothing that I would like to moderate. I was initially against closing OTW because I was afraid that it would spread to other areas of the forum. Fortunately, this did not happen.

I was also a registered user on otw20.com ... mainly to read ... less to participate in discussions (which would be difficult for me as a non-native English speaker anyway). When I think about how often there are misunderstandings when non-native English speakers talk about computer problems, I don't want to know how often there were arguments in OTW when it came to political topics.

There is a point to the rule in English pubs: No politics - no religion ... and in some even the rule: No politics - no religion - no football.

Personally, the only political topics I would be interested in are those related to IT security or encryption.

I am horrified to see how surveillance is progressing worldwide :evil:

...

... but ...

... we will NOT get OTW back with a probability tending towards 1. It was a Council decision at the time ... and we will soon become an SPI project ... which increases the probability to over 1 :lol:

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eccerr0r · Posted: Sun May 05, 2024 11:25 pm Post subject:

turtles · Veteran Joined: 31 Dec 2004 Posts: 1696