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Amon2501
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 12 Dec 2018
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 Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 9:41 am Post subject: How to temporary lock all kde apps to 5 |
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| Hi. How can i temporarily disable moving to kde6 and keep every kde package on its latest available 5 version (they are still in the portage stable)? Thats probably including qt6 locking to 5 too but i`m not sure about the latter. i`ve tried >=kde-plasma/plasma-desktop-5.27.11 but this alone didnt helped much. |
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asturm
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 9:48 am Post subject: |
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Before you are spending time on that, what are your reasons?
KDE Gear 23.08.5 is already being cleaned up right now, step by step, and Plasma 5 will be as soon as possible. |
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Amon2501
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Joined: 12 Dec 2018
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 10:10 am Post subject: |
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| asturm wrote: | Before you are spending time on that, what are your reasons?
KDE Gear 23.08.5 is already being cleaned up right now, step by step, and Plasma 5 will be as soon as possible. |
only 2 reasons
1. i didnt upgraded so frequently probably once or twice in a month. First i need to complete that python migration and without starting another cluster-f... at the same time.
2. I dont want to use wayland, i have -wayland in my make.conf so even if that kde guys says that X sessions will be still available, i`d better wait for a while and watch if there any bugs or in-compatibilities (without being a guinea-pig at the same time). And the recent --sync upgrade also seems to require lot of +wayland autoumasks, which i dont want to do until no 1 is completed. |
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asturm
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 10:26 am Post subject: |
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Disabling USE wayland is futile and fixation on that a pure waste of time, even in Plasma 5 times. It does not affect your X session, it does not save dependencies.
| Amon2501 wrote: | | 1. i didnt upgraded so frequently probably once or twice in a month. First i need to complete that python migration and without starting another cluster-f... at the same time. |
In case you have www-client/falkon-23.08.5 installed, be aware masking upgrades may even complicate your python3_12 migration, as that can only go as high as 3_11 (limitation of dev-python/pyside2). |
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Banana
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Location: Germany
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 10:37 am Post subject: |
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Even if you do not use wayland, it happends to be a dependency. Some packages to build against it, even if you do not use it.
Disabling the usflag creates more problems then solutions.
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Last edited by Banana on Mon Sep 02, 2024 1:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Amon2501
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 12 Dec 2018
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 11:29 am Post subject: |
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| asturm wrote: | | Disabling USE wayland is futile and fixation on that a pure waste of time, even in Plasma 5 times |
This is to make sure that every program actually using X and NOT wayland (and is built for using X). If it`s requires wayland then ok i will make an exception for this particular one.
But still, how can i delay that plasma 6 moving to complete everything first. |
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asturm
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 11:35 am Post subject: |
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| Amon2501 wrote: | | This is to make sure that every program actually using X and NOT wayland (and is built for using X). |
Nothing is using Wayland when you start an X session. |
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Amon2501
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Joined: 12 Dec 2018
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 11:54 am Post subject: |
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| asturm wrote: | | Amon2501 wrote: | | This is to make sure that every program actually using X and NOT wayland (and is built for using X). |
Nothing is using Wayland when you start an X session. |
Just now i ve tried to remove -wayland from make.conf and to re-run emerge --update --deep --ask world. And without this useflag it says like this
| Code: | [ebuild R ] net-misc/remmina-1.4.35-r2 USE="wayland*"
[ebuild R ~] games-util/steam-launcher-1.0.0.81 USE="wayland*"
[ebuild R ] mail-client/thunderbird-115.14.0 USE="wayland*"
[ebuild R ] www-client/firefox-115.14.0 USE="wayland*" |
I`m using them long time without any waylands and these progs are working fine. So that means there is +wayland useflag especially enabled by default in the portage. And my -wayland wasnt just a waste of time. Why should i even build any progs with that wayland support if i never will be using wayland? BTW If someday kde wont provide the X session at all i ll better just move to anothe DE then. |
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dmpogo
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Location: Canada
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 2:46 pm Post subject: Re: How to temporary lock all kde apps to 5 |
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| Amon2501 wrote: | | Hi. How can i temporarily disable moving to kde6 and keep every kde package on its latest available 5 version (they are still in the portage stable)? Thats probably including qt6 locking to 5 too but i`m not sure about the latter. i`ve tried >=kde-plasma/plasma-desktop-5.27.11 but this alone didnt helped much. |
I am not exactly in your situation, but somewhat close. I just currently updated to KDE6 on my old desktop that I can use for tests, but for my laptop the update came in unfortunate moment - tomorrow the university term starts, and I need to give regular lectures, so I can't risk (and do not have much time either) to screw up my laptop. My next window to do major update will be near Christmas, I think, so I will just not touch 'emerge' to that time. In the meantime, I hope even more packages will get updated to kde6/qt6 |
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mrbassie
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Joined: 31 May 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Go past the sign for cope, right at the sign for seethe. If you see the target you've missed it.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 3:28 pm Post subject: Re: How to temporary lock all kde apps to 5 |
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| Amon2501 wrote: | | Hi. How can i temporarily disable moving to kde6 and keep every kde package on its latest available 5 version (they are still in the portage stable)? Thats probably including qt6 locking to 5 too but i`m not sure about the latter. i`ve tried >=kde-plasma/plasma-desktop-5.27.11 but this alone didnt helped much. |
I did the upgrade yesterday and found it a little janky, most notably I couldn't get sddm 0.21 to work properly, it would start but not restart, switch user locked up the system and logging out just led to a black screen with blinking cursor so couldn't change session type. Couldn't find anything on how to fix. So, I rolled back a snapshot, masked >kde-plasma/plasma-meta-5.27.11-r2 and >x11-misc/sddm-0.18.1-r8, and added | Code: | | --exclude plasma-meta --exclude sddm --exclude qtbase --exclude qt5compat --exclude kirigami --exclude ksvg --exclude libplasma --exclude plasma-vault --exclude qtmultimedia |
to EMERGE_DEFAULT_OPTS. Those were what portage was moaning about in my case.
I'm going to let plasma6 bake a little more.
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Amon2501
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 12 Dec 2018
Posts: 140
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 3:57 pm Post subject: Re: How to temporary lock all kde apps to 5 |
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| mrbassie wrote: | I couldn't get sddm 0.21 to work properly, it would start but not restart, switch user locked up the system and logging out just led to a black screen with blinking cursor so couldn't change session type. Couldn't find anything on how to fix. So, I rolled back a snapshot, masked >kde-plasma/plasma-meta-5.27.11-r2 and >x11-misc/sddm-0.18.1-r8, and added | Code: | | --exclude plasma-meta --exclude sddm --exclude qtbase --exclude qt5compat --exclude kirigami --exclude ksvg --exclude libplasma --exclude plasma-vault --exclude qtmultimedia |
to EMERGE_DEFAULT_OPTS. Those were what portage was moaning about in my case.
I'm going to let plasma6 bake a little more. |
Exactly what i`m using. If sddm wont work after the upgrade that`s a deal breaker. And the best thing to do will be just NOT to upgrade for a couple of weeks. |
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mrbassie
l33t
Joined: 31 May 2013
Posts: 821
Location: Go past the sign for cope, right at the sign for seethe. If you see the target you've missed it.
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 4:06 pm Post subject: |
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I previously couldn't get sddm-0.20 to work either, so I had that mask applied already and just commented it out yesterday to try the upgrade. I've seen various posts regarding the issue on different distros but none of the suggested workarounds I found worked.
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I spent a christmas in Vienna twenty something years ago. It was a beautiful city. Everyone was so friendly. |
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mirekm
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Joined: 12 Feb 2004
Posts: 216
Location: Gliwice
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| Posted: Mon Sep 02, 2024 8:24 pm Post subject: Re: How to temporary lock all kde apps to 5 |
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I am not exactly in your situation, but somewhat close. I just currently updated to KDE6 on my old desktop that I can use for tests, but for my laptop the update came in unfortunate moment - tomorrow the university term starts, and I need to give regular lectures, so I can't risk (and do not have much time either) to screw up my laptop. My next window to do major update will be near Christmas, I think, so I will just not touch 'emerge' to that time. In the meantime, I hope even more packages will get updated to kde6/qt6[/quote]
You still can build binary packages of kde5, and kde6. And then quickly switch over between if something important will not work.
Building packages of existing system is easy, just quickpkg.
But to build packages for kde6, you have to setup environment with some overlay fs, to avoid writing in real fs. |
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yzg
Guru
Joined: 18 Jun 2005
Posts: 499
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 3:29 am Post subject: |
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To prevent KDE6 update, add these lines to /etc/portage/package.use/ file
| Code: |
# prevent KDE6 update
*/* -kf6compat
>=app-crypt/pinentry-1.3.0 qt5 -qt6
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And add these lines to /etc/portage/package.mask/ file
| Code: |
kde-apps/*:6
kde-plasma/*:6
kde-frameworks/*:6
kde-misc/*:6
net-misc/kio-zeroconf:6
dev-util/kio-perldoc:6
app-editors/kile:0
>=media-libs/libv4l-1.28.1
>=kde-apps/kdemultimedia-meta-24.05
>=kde-apps/kdeadmin-meta-24.05
>=kde-apps/kdecore-meta-24.05
>=kde-apps/kdegraphics-meta-24.05
>=kde-apps/kdeutils-meta-24.05
>=net-im/neochat-24.05
>=net-im/tokodon-24.05
>=net-news/alligator-24.05
>=kde-apps/kdenetwork-meta-24.05
>=www-client/falkon-24.05
>=net-p2p/ktorrent-24.05
>=net-irc/konversation-24.05
>=app-crypt/keysmith-24.05
>=kde-misc/kclock-24.05
>=app-editors/ghostwriter-24.05
>=kde-apps/poxml-24.05
>=kde-apps/umbrello-24.05
>=kde-apps/kde-dev-scripts-24.05
>=media-sound/kasts-24.05
>=media-sound/krecorder-24.05
>=kde-plasma/print-manager-23.08.5-r100
=dev-libs/libgcrypt-1.11.0
=net-misc/kio-zeroconf-23.08.5-r1
=kde-apps/libkcddb-23.08.5-r1
=media-libs/ksanecore-23.08.5-r2
=kde-apps/libksane-24.02.2-r2
=kde-frameworks/purpose-5.116.0-r2
=dev-util/kdevelop-pg-qt-2.3.0
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I hope Gentoo will slow down in taking out KDE5. Important applications are not ported to KDE6 yet, for example: kmymoney. |
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dmpogo
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Posts: 3425
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 4:59 am Post subject: |
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@yzg
In principle KDE5 applications still should run, since update leaves all necessary infrastructure for them in a different slot. Most of kde-frameworks-5 and qt-5 will still be there after update |
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Amon2501
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 12 Dec 2018
Posts: 140
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 11:31 am Post subject: |
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| yzg wrote: | To prevent KDE6 update, add these lines to /etc/portage/package.use/ file
And add these lines to /etc/portage/package.mask/ file
| Code: |
kde-apps/*:6
kde-plasma/*:6
kde-frameworks/*:6
kde-misc/*:6
net-misc/kio-zeroconf:6
dev-util/kio-perldoc:6 |
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Are you sure that these are for Preventing the upgrade? It is 6 slot not 5 |
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asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 9270
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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It would probably help if y'all would stop using the completely useless terms "KDE5" and "KDE6". There is no such thing, so stop understanding it as monolithic blocks of software.
Of course there is no reason why KDE Frameworks 5-based software would not work inside a KF6-based Plasma 6 environment, much like in any non-Qt environment as well, except that you won't even notice the difference inside Plasma, until you look it up in the "About" dialog. |
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dmpogo
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Posts: 3425
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 4:27 pm Post subject: |
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| asturm wrote: | It would probably help if y'all would stop using the completely useless terms "KDE5" and "KDE6". There is no such thing, so stop understanding it as monolithic blocks of software.
Of course there is no reason why KDE Frameworks 5-based software would not work inside a KF6-based Plasma 6 environment, much like in any non-Qt environment as well, except that you won't even notice the difference inside Plasma, until you look it up in the "About" dialog. |
Well, I got "Redshift control wizard is not compatible with Plasma 6', so there can be things that worked with the previous version and not anymore.
BTW, can we say Plasma 6 ?
Saying that, update went rather smoothly, kudos to developers and maintainers !.
One issue I am looking at is that fonts in Konsole seems wrong. I use Dejavu Mono 14 pt, and it looked a bit squashed and letter are two spaced and sometimes seem non uniformly.. Basically if I put side by side
a sample from font dialog while editing profile, it looks good, and different from what konsole shows. Fonts in menus and taskbar look fine. |
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asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 9270
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 4:37 pm Post subject: |
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| dmpogo wrote: | | Well, I got "Redshift control wizard is not compatible with Plasma 6', so there can be things that worked with the previous version and not anymore. |
plasma-redshift-control was last-rited in 2020, what are you talking about exactly? Yes, unmaintained software often falls by the wayside on such occasions, no, that does not really seem to be what yzg is going on about.
Plasma Nightlight as part of plasma-workspace exists for a long time.
| dmpogo wrote: | | BTW, can we say Plasma 6 ? |
Since this is a well defined product set, everyone will know what you are talking about, for sure. |
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dmpogo
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Joined: 02 Sep 2004
Posts: 3425
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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| asturm wrote: | | dmpogo wrote: | | Well, I got "Redshift control wizard is not compatible with Plasma 6', so there can be things that worked with the previous version and not anymore. |
plasma-redshift-control was last-rited in 2020, what are you talking about exactly? Yes, unmaintained software often falls by the wayside on such occasions, no, that does not really seem to be what yzg is going on about.
Plasma Nightlight as part of plasma-workspace exists for a long time.
| dmpogo wrote: | | BTW, can we say Plasma 6 ? |
Since this is a well defined product set, everyone will know what you are talking about, for sure. |
Thanks ! I guess it was something that sat in the corner and was working for ages. |
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tomtom69
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Joined: 09 Nov 2010
Posts: 253
Location: Bavaria
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Amon2501 wrote: |
I`m using them long time without any waylands and these progs are working fine. So that means there is +wayland useflag especially enabled by default in the portage. And my -wayland wasnt just a waste of time. Why should i even build any progs with that wayland support if i never will be using wayland? BTW If someday kde wont provide the X session at all i ll better just move to anothe DE then. |
Sometimes it is easier to use the default use flags even if you are not using features like wayland at all. Not used wayland support will not cost any performance and not much memory but it avoids strange dependency or use flag complications.
You can still use X and not use wayland even with standard use flags (as I do because I want to test new things on my machine first before rolling it out on my family's PCs) and you won't be bothered by wayland.
Or is there any more specific reason for "-wayland"?
Tom |
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dmpogo
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Posts: 3425
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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| tomtom69 wrote: | | Amon2501 wrote: |
I`m using them long time without any waylands and these progs are working fine. So that means there is +wayland useflag especially enabled by default in the portage. And my -wayland wasnt just a waste of time. Why should i even build any progs with that wayland support if i never will be using wayland? BTW If someday kde wont provide the X session at all i ll better just move to anothe DE then. |
Sometimes it is easier to use the default use flags even if you are not using features like wayland at all. Not used wayland support will not cost any performance and not much memory but it avoids strange dependency or use flag complications.
You can still use X and not use wayland even with standard use flags (as I do because I want to test new things on my machine first before rolling it out on my family's PCs) and you won't be bothered by wayland.
Or is there any more specific reason for "-wayland"?
Tom |
We do not search for easy ways sometimes 
Overall, I try to keep my setup tidy of unnecessary things for a) aesthetical reasons and more importantly, to avoid some new chains of dependencies that will have to be updated along the way without any benefit.
As an example, updating to KDE6 (honorable asturn dislikes the term, sorry), I noticed that I got lapack/numpy coming out of nowhere. What caused it is appearance of opencv, 255 MB package. Which is required by .... a single program kde-apps/spectacle that makes screenshots!
The fact that I have to carry a linear algebra package ( which I like, but I use intel MKL for work) and, full suite of python numerical recipes in numpy just to store pixels from my screen, offends my sensibilities . So, alas, goodbye spectacle that carries 260 MB unique dependencies, bact to x11-apps/screengrab which weighs 400k all included. |
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asturm
Developer
Joined: 05 Apr 2007
Posts: 9270
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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| dmpogo wrote: | | As an example, updating to KDE6 |
When you say "KDE6", how do KF5-based packages part of KDE Gear 24.05.2 (and even still in 24.08.0) fit into the picture for you?
| dmpogo wrote: | | I noticed that I got lapack/numpy coming out of nowhere. What caused it is appearance of opencv, 255 MB package. Which is required by .... a single program kde-apps/spectacle that makes screenshots! |
I think opencv can be slimmed down quite a bit. If you e.g. have lapack and numpy as a result pulled in, then that is a function of having USE="lapack python" enabled on that package, which is not required for spectacle. I'm surprised you didn't look into that, first thing. |
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tomtom69
Apprentice
Joined: 09 Nov 2010
Posts: 253
Location: Bavaria
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 8:35 pm Post subject: |
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[quote="dmpogo"][quote="tomtom69"] | Amon2501 wrote: |
We do not search for easy ways sometimes :)
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OK, that was what I got wrong :D
I also used Gentoo a long time the "minimal way" and avoided any unnecessary dependency but meanwhile all family PCs use Gentoo and must work with minimal support so my policy changed somewhat.
This is the freedom of choice that I like very much with Gentoo, even when my use case is different with yours. |
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dmpogo
Advocate
Joined: 02 Sep 2004
Posts: 3425
Location: Canada
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| Posted: Tue Sep 03, 2024 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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| asturm wrote: | | dmpogo wrote: | | As an example, updating to KDE6 |
When you say "KDE6", how do KF5-based packages part of KDE Gear 24.05.2 (and even still in 24.08.0) fit into the picture for you?
| dmpogo wrote: | | I noticed that I got lapack/numpy coming out of nowhere. What caused it is appearance of opencv, 255 MB package. Which is required by .... a single program kde-apps/spectacle that makes screenshots! |
I think opencv can be slimmed down quite a bit. If you e.g. have lapack and numpy as a result pulled in, then that is a function of having USE="lapack python" enabled on that package, which is not required for spectacle. I'm surprised you didn't look into that, first thing. |
I actually did look, but briefly, and it seemed to me that opencv (although having lapack USE flag) unconditionally depended on virtual/cblas which in turn depended on lapack as first alternative anyway. But I may be wrong. Also I missed that USE='python' can mean numpy, usually these are some python bindings. But of course the largest thing is opencv itself, as advertised "OpenCV is the world's biggest computer vision library.".
Naming wise, first time I noticed the term KDE Gear two days ago . It was always kde-apps in my head. Yep, quite a few of them are on KF5 and qt5. |
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