Giving Gnome a spin and me a headache!

ebrostig

Ok, so I was going to give Gnome 2.6 a spin on my new AMD64 box.

Should be easy enough, huh? Well, so I hoped too.

The first issue is ofcourse that Gnome insists on installing Mozilla even though I have Mozilla-FireFox installed and don't need Mozilla with all the extra programs i don't need.

Ok, no problem, I have more than enough space so who cares

Second problem, mozilla 1.6 does not compile on my AMD64 box, so i manually emerge the lastest version, 1.7_rc1, which compiled and installed fine.

Back to emerging Gnome...
Oooppsss Epiphany breaks, it doesn't recognize Mozilla 1.7rc1. Hmmmm... versions are hardcoded in the 'configure' file, added entry for 1.7rc1 and did 'ebuild ..... compile' Worked fine. Installed and emerged. Back to emerging gnome... Rest ran fine, np.

Restarted xdm to get gdm and logged in to a very boring desktop.

First step, change background image. I have some really great space art in my .wallpapers directory. Ok, click on "Applications', then 'Desktop Preferences', then 'Desktop background' What????? It doesn't show my hidden directories? hmmm.... no way of changing the behaviour. Ok, close the app and click on "Applications', then 'Desktop Preferences', then 'File Management'. Cool, there is an entry here, 'Show hidden and backup files'. Selected it and closed the app and went back to changing my background. What???? Still no hidden directories? WTF! This is crazy. back and check that I actually select what i thought I ahd selected. Yes, still there. Damn! What is happening?

At that point I wipped open a texteditor and started to write this. Hmmm select and paste does not work, wtf? I can't mark text using the mouse and then paste it using my middle button? What the heck is going on with gnome?

Ok, so I logged out and back in again to see if I could see my hidden files. Nope, same result and the File Management still shows that I selected showing hidden files. Excellent piece of software!

GConf Editor! Yeah, that's got to be it!
I tremble as i open this mysterical piece of software... Hmmmm... Where would it be that i configure the File open dialog to show hidden files... Hmmmm... There is about a gazillion different possibilities in here and i'm not going to go through all of them. that would be insane to expect from people. Ok, no background image for the moment.

Next step, change fonts to Bitstream Vera, not a problem except for the following: "Window Title Font" This entry is not selectable and i can not change this font. Stupid!

Now I need to change the panels so they hide automatically. i don't need to stare at them and they occupy screen estate. Hmmm... Nowhere is this configuration to be found.... Ahh, I have to right-click on each of the panels, then select properties before I can hide them. geezzz... Is it so damn difficult to put all of this into one single place where all options can be changed without having to do research to find this? And the damn panels do not pop out of my way immediatly nor do they appear immediatly when I move the curosr over them, but i can't find any option to change the timing. Crap!

So here I am, with a useless Gnome installation and another confirmation that Gnome is worthless!

Erik
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'Yes, Firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'

chrisis · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:38 am Post subject:

hmm. I don't have any hassles with gnome, but I admit I haven't tried to do the stuff you are doing. Maybe I should!

Have you tried typing in the .directory into the file open dialogue?
_________________
But the situation seemed to call for witty repartee. "Huh?" I said.

ebrostig · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:42 am Post subject:

shm · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 12:44 am Post subject:

ebrostig · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 1:05 am Post subject:

ebrostig · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 1:20 am Post subject:

Oh another issue....

GDM can't seem to figure out that i have KDE installed whereas KDM had no problems figuring out that I had Gnome installed.

Is this a bug in GDM or a "feature"?

Erik
_________________
'Yes, Firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'

shm · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 1:48 am Post subject:

ebrostig · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 2:19 am Post subject:

bssteph · l33t Joined: 26 Feb 2003 Posts: 652 Location: Wisconsin

fusibou · Tux's lil' helper Joined: 25 Mar 2003 Posts: 109

To avoid compiling epiphany (which I do) just use the emerge -i (inject) command for the epiphany package and mozilla.

ebrostig · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 4:39 pm Post subject:

vificunero

ralph · Advocate Joined: 02 Mar 2003 Posts: 2001 Location: Hamburg

hellbringer · Tux's lil' helper Joined: 12 Feb 2003 Posts: 82

dweigert · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 6:10 pm Post subject:

Strangely enough I'm having some issues of my own with 2.6, in a udev environment on an Opteron box. It *used* to work, now it wont get past starting the session manager. All I get on vt7 is a dark blue screen with the Gentoo Gnome splash in the middle. Nothing else comes up. Any ideas?

Dan
_________________
"Always remember to mount a scratch monkey..."

jonnevers · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 6:11 pm Post subject:

There are some nice rants in this thread! A+ guys!

ebrostig

ebrostig · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 6:30 pm Post subject:

vificunero

ebrostig

Epyon · l33t Joined: 11 Sep 2003 Posts: 754 Location: NJ, USA

jonnevers · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 6:55 pm Post subject:

sapphirecat · Guru Joined: 15 Jan 2003 Posts: 376

Heh, I'm with you on this one. I can't stand to use the stupid thing long enough to get it set up.

Sins of Gnome from my POV, somewhat abridged:

If you want to delete both panels and then put your own somewhere else, you can't. They decided being able to add a panel from something besides right-clicking panels wasn't necessary. You have to reorder the natural operation to fit their broken design.
The "file management" icon in preferences:/// looks like a folder! Doesn't this project have usability experts behind it? Overloading icons is insane. (Though I got to it through a "Start Here" desktop item that may have been carried over all the way from an old Red Hat install...)
Nautilus doesn't have any way to compactly view humongous directories. It has large icons or details, and not list view, in Win95 parlance.
The "menu panel" is far too special and annoying about doing anything to/with it. KISS. Sorta leads into next point.
Everything on the panels comes locked by default, so there's the extra hoop of right-clicking things and saying "Unlock" if, Heaven forbid, you don't like the default layout.
The new fileselector is the result of massive ego-stroking and the GTK team caving to "do it now" instead of "do it right". (And even so, it held back Gnome's release.) But at least it isn't Eugenia's.
Apparently middle-drag does something nifty in Nautilus in 2.6. Since careless use of the middle button often results in pasting and other weird stuff, IMHO nearly everyone is going to avoid middle-mousing anything and especially never drag with it (superjaded excepted). I'm old enough to remember MS being roundly lambasted for inventing right-drag in Win95...
Metacity is the worst window manager EVER. Just try to print something in GIMP with the default panel layout on 800x600. It doesn't let the titlebar escape the top of screen, so you can't even see the save settings/Print buttons even if you know about alt-drag.

I think the root of the problems are that the Gnome developers think they can do everything better than anyone else, and they've lost track of reality. A project that drives away power users will not find those users interested in writing code for it.
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Former Gentoo user; switched to Kubuntu 7.04 when I got sick of waiting on gcc. Chance of thread necro if you reply now approaching 100%...

dweigert · Posted: Thu Apr 29, 2004 8:16 pm Post subject:

j-kidd · Apprentice Joined: 20 Feb 2003 Posts: 213

You guys obviously do not understand the GNOME philosophy. Well, let me explain using a real life example...

Look at the KDE toilet, it has a sink, a toilet bowl, and a bath tub. There are altogether 3 water related tools, and an average user is obviously going to be very confused! Imagine a scenario where Joe User, a complete newbie, would like to wash his face. Guess which one he is going to use? The toilet bowl! It is the only one that has visible water! See, it is clear that the KDE is so bloated and unusable for an average user.

Now, let's redesign the toilet following GNOME HIG.

First, the bath tub is discarded as usability studies have shown that an average user simply does not take shower. For those who do take shower, there is always rain.

Secondly, the sink is discarded as well since there is already a kitchen sink and, after all, the toilet bowl has all the important functions provided by the sink. Users just have to get used to it.

Thirdly, the toilet handle is redesigned so that push-down-flush is replaced by pull-up-flush. Usability studies, again, have shown that human eyes tend to scan the shit from bottom to top, and thus pulling up the handle to flush is more intuitive.

Forth, as an usability perk, the toilet bowl will pump up water if the handle is pushed down. This makes tasks like washing face that much more convenient yet the tools remain minimal.

Well, great, it is now a fully HIG compliance toilet. There is no bloat, and everything just makes sense, doesn't it? That Erik guy, who complains that all the shit jumped out to his face when he flushed the toilet, that he couldn't find any way to wash the mess, that he really does take shower every other day, is just a typical KDE luser that does not appreciate usability :twisted: