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genmich
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Evangelion
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Joined: 31 May 2002
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Location: Helsinki, Finland
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 Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 1:18 pm Post subject: |
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| Ian Goldby wrote: | | R!tman wrote: | | Ok, maybe some programs run on Mac OS, but it is still proprietary software, not open source. Don't underestimate the ethical issue here, for some this is a bit point. |
My point was really that if you aren't going to run OS X, why bother paying the extra for the premium Apple hardware? |
Because Apple-hardware is drop-dead sexy, it has lots of nice touches, it's made from aluminium, the quality is good, there are no "reflective" screens, stickers or flashing lights and because by buying Apple-hardware, not a dime of that money goes to Microsoft?
Compare to PC-laptops (or tower-PC's): they are made from plastic, they feel flimsy and cheap, they look very generic, they all have Microsoft-tax in 'em, no little nice things come included, they have stickers, fans, flashing LED's and the like.
Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
I have handled both iBooks and PowerBooks. And I have handled similarly priced PC-laptops. And in each and every time, the Mac-laptop feels so much better and sturdier than the PC-laptop does! I have handled used PowerBooks as well, and they have felt really, really good. I have handled used HP-laptops (N600 and NC6000). and they feel flimsy and run-down.
| Quote: | | I know that. What I thought was that all of the recent PPC offerings from Apple used 64-bit PPC processors, and that OS X itself was 64 bit. Are you saying this is or isn't the case? |
G5 (used in Xserve, PowerMac and iMac) is 64bit, G4 (used by PowerBook, iBook and Mac Mini) is 32bit. Yes, iMac moved from 64bit CPU to 32bit CPU. But that's not a problem, since the machine couldn't physically have over 4GB of RAM anyway.
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pinger
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 18 Mar 2004
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| pinger wrote: | | When are the first units going to be delivered? |
My local apple store says that macbook pro's haven't even started being produced yet, and they don't expect them to be available before the end of February or even early March. |
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genmich
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 4:33 pm Post subject: |
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from ravenz:
| Quote: | My experience booting Windows Vista via iMac Core Duo...
"D" key failed for the following installers:
Ubuntu 5.04 Live CD
Ubuntu 5.04 Install CD
Windows XP 2002 Edition Install CD
SUSE Linux 9.3 Professional Install DVD
SUSE Linux 9.3 Professional Install CD
Solaris 10 x86 03/05 Edition Install DVD
Solaris 10 x86 03/05 Edition Install CD
ParitionMagic 8.0 Install CD
None of the installers above have EFI support, as far as I know.
Someone with a Vista beta CD will need to try this.
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http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?t=282078
At least they trying it. Perhaps they figure out a way to run it on Intels. |
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Hamman
n00b
Joined: 09 Jun 2005
Posts: 49
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 6:15 pm Post subject: |
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| miga wrote: | from ravenz:
| Quote: | My experience booting Windows Vista via iMac Core Duo...
"D" key failed for the following installers:
Ubuntu 5.04 Live CD
Ubuntu 5.04 Install CD
Windows XP 2002 Edition Install CD
SUSE Linux 9.3 Professional Install DVD
SUSE Linux 9.3 Professional Install CD
Solaris 10 x86 03/05 Edition Install DVD
Solaris 10 x86 03/05 Edition Install CD
ParitionMagic 8.0 Install CD
None of the installers above have EFI support, as far as I know.
Someone with a Vista beta CD will need to try this.
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http://forums.macnn.com/showthread.php?t=282078
At least they trying it. Perhaps they figure out a way to run it on Intels. |
Methinks(/hopes) someone will make a custom Gentoo install cd with support for EFI. |
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Donpasquale
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Joined: 03 Jan 2003
Posts: 150
Location: Munich
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| Posted: Tue Jan 17, 2006 1:29 pm Post subject: |
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i think that it wont take very long until the macbook pro will boot linux / windows. They only tried the efi aware windows vista cd and no efi aware linux cd. As soon as the macbook pro and intel will go out to enough users it wont take long until someone will make a boot loader work on the macbook.
I cant wait to get the new macbook and try it myself. |
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Lunchy
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Joined: 22 Aug 2003
Posts: 70
Location: Hartford, Wisconsin
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| Posted: Wed Jan 18, 2006 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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| pinger wrote: | | pinger wrote: | | When are the first units going to be delivered? |
My local apple store says that macbook pro's haven't even started being produced yet, and they don't expect them to be available before the end of February or even early March. |
I talked to my CDW rep about this yesterday and she said they expect to recieve their first shipment of MacBooks on 2/28/06. *droooool*
But of course, that date isn't set in stone.
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petrjanda
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Location: Brno, Czech Republic
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| Posted: Thu Jan 19, 2006 11:14 pm Post subject: |
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apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x?
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Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
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you got the facts wrong my friend. cheap as people buy lexus because they cant afford mercedes.
And now excuse me, im drunk 
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There is, a not-born, a not-become, a not-made, a not-compounded. If that unborn, not-become, not-made, not-compounded were not, there would be no escape from this here that is born, become, made and compounded. - Gautama Siddharta |
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apache2
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Joined: 06 Jun 2005
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| Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 4:22 am Post subject: |
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| petrjanda wrote: | apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x?
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Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
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you got the facts wrong my friend. cheap as people buy lexus because they cant afford mercedes.
And now excuse me, im drunk |
Dude..... it is good to be exposed to and experienced in different operating systems.......
so why don't you go screw yourself?  |
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kadajawi
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Joined: 20 Feb 2004
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| Posted: Fri Jan 20, 2006 12:49 pm Post subject: |
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Maybe this thread is interesting for y'all.
http://forum.osx86project.org/index.php?showtopic=7174
Basically they are talking about MacOS X on non-Macs and Windows XP on Macs. They were talking about some sort of CSM or so which seems to... eh, emulate a BIOS or so. |
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petrjanda
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Location: Brno, Czech Republic
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| Posted: Sat Jan 21, 2006 11:01 am Post subject: |
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| apache2 wrote: | | petrjanda wrote: | apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x?
| Quote: |
Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
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you got the facts wrong my friend. cheap as people buy lexus because they cant afford mercedes.
And now excuse me, im drunk |
Dude..... it is good to be exposed to and experienced in different operating systems.......
so why don't you go screw yourself? |
it perverts your and mine freedom!
apple is a circus leader and you are a clown.
_________________
There is, a not-born, a not-become, a not-made, a not-compounded. If that unborn, not-become, not-made, not-compounded were not, there would be no escape from this here that is born, become, made and compounded. - Gautama Siddharta |
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GNUtoo
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 7:39 am Post subject: |
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there is a problem(at least on the imac)...
the X86 imac don't boot on normal cd
http://nak.journalspace.com/
but mabe mac-os can be used for the gentoo installation
for efi even the kernel is ok...(simply select the boot from efi option) |
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GNUtoo
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 8:18 am Post subject: |
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| apache2 wrote: | | petrjanda wrote: | apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x?
| Quote: |
Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
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you got the facts wrong my friend. cheap as people buy lexus because they cant afford mercedes.
And now excuse me, im drunk |
Dude..... it is good to be exposed to and experienced in different operating systems.......
so why don't you go screw yourself? |
and mac-os's base is open-source...
and why gentoo users get interested in HARDWARE... that's because there are the first one to provide core-duo product and that
there are also some people interested in others os...most of mac-os is open-source...(but the graphical interface is closed source)
yes...linux is better but...mabe not for evrybody...(open-source is better for anyone but others os have some "little" advanteges over open-source-linux(there are a lot of comercial gui with comercial linux) in some domain)
some people find mac-os easy=>good for computer newbees and maintenable for admins or "people helping theses newbees" because portage can run on it(there are some problems with portage because developers need to makes change to mac-os in order to permit the use of certain package...and that changes are problematics...)
and i think lindows-like users will be the near-future...
mabe there will be a react-os with unix implementation in the kernel...(free software...not comercial)
microsoft has lost the juridical battle between sco(paid by microsoft...there are proofs) and linux
microsoft can't use fat patent or similar things because:
->a lot of comercial distribution avoid the use of it
->IBM has a lot of patent that will put microsoft in a difficult position...because microsoft infridge ibm's patent with windows
and so...microsoft changed attitude and became a lot more open-source friendly(open-source lab,channel9,clannel9 wiki software->open-source...,intervideo is porting windows media to linux...)
do you know SFU(services for unix)...it's a interace between windowsNT(2000,xp,2003,vista...) and unix aplications...
microsoft provide it for free(now because before it wasn't) and will include it in all the future version of windows...
and so...sfu is only a base(there is nearly no apps inside...it's a developer nightmare for making scripts for windows users) and microsoft could use it to install tools and a package manager...in order to run windows and "linux" apps...
and wine can already be more performant than windowsXP(http://wiki.winehq.org/BenchMark-0.9.5) and if react-os peolpe decide to include unix natively inside the react-os kernel...react-os would be faster and not comercial...
but vista isn't ready yet(and mabe it will take also a lot of time to decide to include linux package management into windows) and wine isn't version 1.xx(0.9.6) and react-os is not yet 1.xx and fully compatible...
another advantege from linux is open-source...
but if microsoft is preparing to face linux...the open-source is a too big advantage...
so they have links with hardware vendor...and it's strange but many of them don't relase anymore the specifications but instead relase closed-source binaries...so microsoft cancel the open-source advantage...too bad (because no hardware support isn't an option, and so microsoft would be closed source and run open-source apps(they are working with the compatibility of them at the open-source lab) and linux would also have closed source interfaced with the kernel and with open-source apps)
but...mabe open-source will win(as usual...)
ask me to delete this post if it's too much out of topic
normaly such post are for "off the wall" by the way off the wall talk about general linux things(iptables that aren't specific to gentoo) to others things that aren't even related to computers |
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GNUtoo
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Posts: 1919
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| chaotician wrote: |
Gentoo
OSX
Vista
Tri-Boot - w00t! |
lol
is there any partition limit as bios limitation for efi???
because if not that would be cool
->gentoo,mac-os(mabe not...it cost money and is nearly useless for me but interesting),windowsXP/2k(for developement but need bios emulation i've already a licence(with a computer buyed with supermarket point+money...couldn't return the windows(seemed too complicated)...)),react-os,open-solaris,net-bsd,freedos...you could even test linux distributions(some are obtimised) in order to compare the speed with gentoo |
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rotlicht
n00b
Joined: 25 Nov 2005
Posts: 25
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 10:18 am Post subject: Efi |
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I already had to do with the EFI Bios which is used by the MacBook Pro because I installed a 4 processor cluster which had efi on board. Not an easy thing I can tell but it should work.
The only thing you need seems to be elilo which is the lilo pendant for the efi bios. Just to make you things easier. You need one fat partition where you put the kernel in. This is important. Don't use efi or efi gpt as partition type. That took 3 or four days until I got it. ANother thing is if you boot from the life cd from gentoo and you emerged elilo make an "export loop=,loop" elilo needed that to install correctly. |
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PaveQ
Apprentice
Joined: 11 Feb 2005
Posts: 225
Location: Finland
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 3:05 pm Post subject: Re: Efi |
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| rotlicht wrote: | I already had to do with the EFI Bios which is used by the MacBook Pro because I installed a 4 processor cluster which had efi on board. Not an easy thing I can tell but it should work.
The only thing you need seems to be elilo which is the lilo pendant for the efi bios. Just to make you things easier. You need one fat partition where you put the kernel in. This is important. Don't use efi or efi gpt as partition type. That took 3 or four days until I got it. ANother thing is if you boot from the life cd from gentoo and you emerged elilo make an "export loop=,loop" elilo needed that to install correctly. |
Why would you need fat partition? |
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Evangelion
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Joined: 31 May 2002
Posts: 1087
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 3:34 pm Post subject: |
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| petrjanda wrote: | | apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x? |
Dude, take a god damned chill-pill and THEN come and talk! Your blathering makes ZERO sense!
Apple makes hardware. I could get a Dell-machine, or I could get a Apple-machine. What makes Dell-machine more acceptabe than Apple-hardware? Here are few FACTS for you to ponder on:
a) if you buy a Dell, part of that money propably goes to Microsoft
b) Apple actually uses and supports Open Source. They are major contributors to GCC, KHTML and the like.
c) Apple does not have a monopoly, Microsoft does. Why should I spend my money on piece of hardware that has "designed for Windows XP"-sticker on it? why should I buy products from a company that has ads that say "XXXXXX Recommends Windows XP"? Oh yes, giving money for those kind of companies is perfectly acceptable, whereas giving money to a company that actively tries to take market-share away from MS is bad, mmmmkay?
those are FACTS. Seriously:are you living in a bizarro-world?
So why exactly should I buy a Dell-machine, or Gateway, or Sony? why shouldn't I buy Apple-hardware? How exactly am I "supporting closed-source", if I buy a Mac, erase OS X from it and run Linux instead? How exactly am I supporting open source if I buy a Dell-laptop, erase Windows from it and use Linux instead? By your logic, the former means "supporting closed source", whereas the latter is acceptable. But where is the difference?
| Quote: | | And now excuse me, im drunk |
That explains the moronic drivel that you are spouting....
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Last edited by Evangelion on Sun Jan 22, 2006 3:38 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Evangelion
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Location: Helsinki, Finland
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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| petrjanda wrote: | | apache2 wrote: | | petrjanda wrote: | apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x?
| Quote: |
Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
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you got the facts wrong my friend. cheap as people buy lexus because they cant afford mercedes.
And now excuse me, im drunk |
Dude..... it is good to be exposed to and experienced in different operating systems.......
so why don't you go screw yourself? |
it perverts your and mine freedom!
apple is a circus leader and you are a clown. |
There's nothing preventing me or anyone else to erase OS X and use Linux on that Mac instead. Why isn't that acceptable? "well, because I say so!"
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petrjanda
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Location: Brno, Czech Republic
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| Posted: Sun Jan 22, 2006 10:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Evangelion wrote: |
a) if you buy a Dell, part of that money propably goes to Microsoft
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Dell what? 
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b) Apple actually uses and supports Open Source. They are major contributors to GCC, KHTML and the like.
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Wiki-pedia lists MacOSX as closed source.
http://ln.com.ua/~openxs/projects/man/unix/unix.png
I couldnt help it
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So why exactly should I buy a Dell-machine, or Gateway, or Sony? why shouldn't I buy Apple-hardware? How exactly am I "supporting closed-source"
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You are giving money to people that do not make free and fully open software.
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There is, a not-born, a not-become, a not-made, a not-compounded. If that unborn, not-become, not-made, not-compounded were not, there would be no escape from this here that is born, become, made and compounded. - Gautama Siddharta |
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Evangelion
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Location: Helsinki, Finland
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| Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 8:32 am Post subject: |
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| petrjanda wrote: | | Wiki-pedia lists MacOSX as closed source. |
And I wouldn't be running OS X. So your point is.... What? And OS X has LOTS of open-source stuff in it (KHTML, X, GCC etc. etc., and Apple DOES contribute back to those projects). Some pieces are closed, but others are open. And still, I would be running Linux on that hardware.
| Quote: | | Quote: |
So why exactly should I buy a Dell-machine, or Gateway, or Sony? why shouldn't I buy Apple-hardware? How exactly am I "supporting closed-source"
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You are giving money to people that do not make free and fully open software. |
But they do contribute a lot to many open-source projects, like KHTML and GCC. That's something Microsoft does NOT do. Yet you claim that lining Microsofts pockets is acceptable. Giving money to some other company that promotes Windows is perfectly acceptable. Yes, I guess that makes perfect sense in bizarro-world.
Just to re-iterate: this is about hardware. Many people buy hardware made by various companies, just to run Linux on 'em. And most of the time, those companies are in cahoots with Microsoft. Hell, usually that hardware comes with Windows preinstalled! But to you, giving money to such companies is perfectly acceptable, but for some reason giving money to a big backer of KHTML, GCC and various other open-source tools is NOT accepable.
What has Apple and Microsoft said about Open source?
Apple: "Open-source software. We think it's great!"
Microsoft: "Open-source is cancer"
What do you think of supporting those companies?
Supporting Apple: "No! Are you crazy?"
Supporting Microsoft: "Go right ahead"
Yep, welcome to bizarro-world. But hey, if you want to promote Microsoft, go right ahead!
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petrjanda
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| Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 12:25 pm Post subject: |
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| Evangelion wrote: | | petrjanda wrote: | | Wiki-pedia lists MacOSX as closed source. |
And I wouldn't be running OS X. So your point is.... What? And OS X has LOTS of open-source stuff in it (KHTML, X, GCC etc. etc., and Apple DOES contribute back to those projects). Some pieces are closed, but others are open. And still, I would be running Linux on that hardware.
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the point was that its not free and fully open.
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you claim that lining Microsofts pockets is acceptable. Giving money to some other company that promotes Windows is perfectly acceptable. Yes, I guess that makes perfect sense in bizarro-world.
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Never said that.
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Just to re-iterate: this is about hardware.
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I know its about hardware. Sure, apple has the right to sell its own hardware, but the OS must be fully open and free.
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Apple: "Open-source software. We think it's great!"
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Only because a significant part of the OS runs on freebsd. Without it, itd be shit, and apple's image would suffer terribly.
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There is, a not-born, a not-become, a not-made, a not-compounded. If that unborn, not-become, not-made, not-compounded were not, there would be no escape from this here that is born, become, made and compounded. - Gautama Siddharta |
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sktrdie
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| Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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| petrjanda wrote: | apple, like microsoft, can go fuck itself with all its products. os x is bullshit, although perhaps apple hardware looks nice, but that its only selling point. im appaled that gentoo users are even interested in this. if you guys were lindows users, id say good for you god damn it, but you guys openly admit to support closed source and wanna be monopoly company, so that leaves one question to me, why the fuck do you use oss and dont go screw your self over os x?
| Quote: |
Why do people pay premium for Lexus, when they could buy a Ford for less?
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you got the facts wrong my friend. cheap as people buy lexus because they cant afford mercedes.
And now excuse me, im drunk |
I think you are right, Apple is just as bad as Maicrosoft when you talk about freedom and open-source. Of course Maicrosoft is a huge fucking monopoly that tries to suck everything, with patents all over and also working related with the US gov (not Apple). In other words don't but Maicrosoft, if you have to go closed-source buy Apple. As I only do free software (free as in freedom) I don't support microsoft. I would buy laptops from linuxcertified.com or emperorlinux.com for example, they are fully supporting linux and good quality hardware, so no money goes to Maicrosoft. But Apple has good hardware, but in the sense of supporting free-software community buying an Apple machine is just like buying a Maicrosoft machine.
good luck  |
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Evangelion
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Joined: 31 May 2002
Posts: 1087
Location: Helsinki, Finland
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| Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:25 pm Post subject: |
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| petrjanda wrote: | | Evangelion wrote: | | petrjanda wrote: | | Wiki-pedia lists MacOSX as closed source. |
And I wouldn't be running OS X. So your point is.... What? And OS X has LOTS of open-source stuff in it (KHTML, X, GCC etc. etc., and Apple DOES contribute back to those projects). Some pieces are closed, but others are open. And still, I would be running Linux on that hardware.
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the point was that its not free and fully open. |
What is? The OS? For the last time: I WOULDN'T BE RUNNING THAT OS! Windows is not open either, yet you don't whine when people buy hardware that was designed for Windows! Double-standards and hypocrisy? it sure seems like that to me!
| Quote: | | Quote: |
you claim that lining Microsofts pockets is acceptable. Giving money to some other company that promotes Windows is perfectly acceptable. Yes, I guess that makes perfect sense in bizarro-world.
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Never said that. |
Oh yes you did. Maybe not with those words, but the message is there. Buying Apple is apparently not OK. Then why is it OK to buy Sony, Dell, Gateway or HP? All those companies recommend XP, all those companies design their computers for Windows, all those companies pay money to Microsoft. Why is it OK to buy one of those computers, but it's NOT ok to buy a Mac? Answer that question. I'm just dying to hear your logic and insight on this matter!
| Quote: | | I know its about hardware. Sure, apple has the right to sell its own hardware, but the OS must be fully open and free. |
You just don't seem to get it. So I'll use simple words:
- If I bought a MacBook, I would erase OS X, and replace it with Linux.
- As a result, the OS I would be running would be 100% open source and free.
- Therefore, it's 100% irrelevant what kind of OS OS X would be, since I WOULD NOT BE RUNNING IT.
Now, before you start your blathering about "but you would be giving money to company that makes closed-source OS", answer me this question:
Why is it not OK for me to buy a Mac-laptop and run Linux on it, whereas it would be perfectly acceptable to buy some PC-laptop that was designed for Windows XP, whose manufacturer promotes Windows, who pays Microsoft money for every laptop they ship? A simple question, so please answer it.
Continuation of that question: Apple is a big supporter of open source. Their contributions to GCC, KHTML and the like can't be denied. Microsoft hates open source and free software. Why is it not OK to give money to a company that supports major open-source projects, but giving money to Microsoft is acceptable? Again: answer the question. Don't try to avoid the question, just answer it.
| Quote: | | Quote: |
Apple: "Open-source software. We think it's great!"
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Only because a significant part of the OS runs on freebsd. Without it, itd be shit, and apple's image would suffer terribly. |
Irrelevant. Fact remains that they are major supporters of open-source projects. Would we be better off if they DIDN'T support open-source? Seriously? I welcome Apple's contribution with open arms.
And they support open-source software outside FreeBSD. Their comment about open source software was made when they announced WebCore. They also contribute to Samba and GCC, and neither of those are related to FreeBSD.
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Last edited by Evangelion on Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:31 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Evangelion
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Location: Helsinki, Finland
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| Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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| sktrdie wrote: | | I think you are right, Apple is just as bad as Maicrosoft when you talk about freedom and open-source. |
Which is why Apple contributes a lot of resources to GCC, KHTML and Samba. Oh wait...
| Quote: | | I would buy laptops from linuxcertified.com or emperorlinux.com for example, they are fully supporting linux and good quality hardware, so no money goes to Maicrosoft. |
Emperorlinux sells rebadged laptops from OEM's. Those laptops originally ran Windows, so Microsoft propably got their money regardless.
| Quote: | | But Apple has good hardware, but in the sense of supporting free-software community buying an Apple machine is just like buying a Maicrosoft machine. |
Considering how much resources Apple has thrown behind various free-software projects, I have no problems buying one of their laptops. And you would be certain that not one dime of that money would go to Microsoft.
yes, their OS is closed. But I wouldn't be running that OS.
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GNUtoo
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| Posted: Mon Jan 23, 2006 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | But they do contribute a lot to many open-source projects, like KHTML and GCC. That's something Microsoft does NOT do. Yet you claim that lining Microsofts pockets is acceptable. Giving money to some other company that promotes Windows is perfectly acceptable. Yes, I guess that makes perfect sense in bizarro-world. |
they now do...in reality there is only a little "open-source lab" that do very little contribution compared to apple they:
-make open-source apps compatible with windows(they comit patch to some open-source project)
-make windows inter-operatible(interoperability) comiting patch to project such as samba
but i do not like microsof...and i won't fall in this open-source trap(they start saying they are open-source friendly)...it reminds me an unfinished open-source game...http://xtux.sourceforge.net/screenshots.html (xtux) where linux people that tryed windows "world domination edition" were iptnotised by windows(i think of sfu and the "open-source friendly" direction that took microsoft recently)...and that makes had makes tux angry...
and for apple...they only recently(1-2-3 years ago) made their change avaliable to an open-source browser that they forked(they did not relased their changes as they mabe should have been obligated to relase(must check the licences))
do they realy commit changes to gcc??? or do they instead have their own OPEN-SOURCE version of gcc
but apple is a lot better than microsoft...less evil(mabe there more or less are ok but i have no proof...i've not disasembled aqua and proprietary apple apps) and most of mac-os is open-source(i think there some are enormous advantages of this model...i'm not critisizing here because that is good and fair if evryone gain something...)
but there is worse than microsoft and apple...google
that IS a threat
as long as you are not dependent from microsoft it's ok...but less now they want to seduce open-source people(usualy open-source comunity faces very well threat from microsoft but now it's a little bit different...but we may winn telling that linux is faster than windows...but there is that damn microsoft marketting and red-hat has abandoned linux for desktop computers...)
apple is more than ok...
but google!!!
they can control INFORMATION!!!
that is very dangerous...
yes they support open-source
but they can and they have controled information (kazaa lite)
and there is this library project...
you have some public domain books(google print i think) that phisicaly belongs to some libraries and universities...
the content is in the public domain...
and the contract between them tell(yes i don't speek very well english) that they have the EXCLUSIVITY for theses books...that's crasy!!!!=>they want to be the one who control information
that was the dream of a lot of person and company such as the famous vivendy that owned too much medias and company that provide content/informations
i love a certain comercial model...
a company or association makes an open-source software
you're a company that want to use their software but this software lack a feature...that is not previsted to include now...
the company pay the open-source producer for a service:adding the functionality
the "open-source producer" put a programmer on the task of adding the feature(open-source licence)
->the "company" saves money/time/... incrase security... because the "open-source provider" had a programer that is used to program on this software,know already how it is written...and is competent,and do the job in less time that the "company" and so is cheaper with a lot of others advantages(better done...)
->the "open-soure provider" own money (they do a benefit) in order to own money(an open-source company) or to cover expenses(an open-source association...such as the gentoo asociation,the python association...)
here you have all the advantages of open-source and buisness combined...wow
this can also be extended to support for a comercial open-source provider... |
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