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lnthai2002
Apprentice
Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 260
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 Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:16 am Post subject: What FLAGS should i use for system optimized for KDE? |
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Hi,
I want to make my gentoo fully tweaked for KDE so what flag should i use in the /etc/make.conf? The handbook say only kde and qt are needed but after install KDE, i realize that gtk was also installed so should i use the gtk and gtk2 flags? Some applications such as eclipse are provided in 2 versions motif and gtk, as far as i know, the gtk is gnome graphic library and qt is something similar in kde world, but i have no idea what motif is so i am confused in choosing correct version. Please give me some suggestion.
Thanks in advance |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 7:15 am Post subject: |
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Well, an advice: don't worry too much about it. It is needed a long time to fully understand what use flags are and to come by with a set that is fully suited for your likings.
The first thing that you have to understand is that use flags do only set optional features. You can perfectly have a fully working kde system with USE="-kde -qt -gtk -gtk2 -gnome". This is because the qt and kde support in the kde programs is not optional, and will be built anyway.
The same applies for gnome, and that is why you have into your system gtk installed, because you probably installed some gtk application (for example the gimp). Doing that you pushed gtk+ into your system, even if you had "-gnome -gtk -gtk2" into your USE.
I use Fvwm but have also kde installed and use it a lot. And my use regarding this are what I posted above. If I need qt support for a program then I activate it for that program in which the support is optional (you can do that into /etc/portage/package.use). I made this to avoid having superfluous stuff into programs that does not need it.
Of course, this is harder to maintain, and I don't recomment it until you have a full understanding of all this stuff. To start with kde I would advice you to go with the standard USE="kde qt arts -gnome -gtk -gtk2". I know that that is too general, but will do for now. There is no need to add that flags just because gtk got installed, it is ok.
-Cheers. |
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kpep01
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Seattle Area, WA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:46 am Post subject: |
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Greetings,
I decided to watch this thread to learn more about USE flags. It appears I might learn well if I ask the proper questions.
For myself, I've tried Gnome and KDE both on a variety of Linux flavors (only Gentoo gives me the true opportunity to learn Linux - hence, my partiality). I prefer KDE.
As a result, the last time I bootstrapped my system (yes, it takes some time to learn how to bootstrap according to taste and work out self-inflicted bugs) I set the USE flags to -gnome -gtk -gtk2. It was my feeling at the moment that I prefered KDE, and I wanted to keep my system as light as possible.
I've noticed, however, that when emerging KDE - as well as latter applications - that parts of Gnome are required dependancies. At least, the way I see what is happening make this appear true.
Sometimes, I've wondered if I screwed myself.
It appears, however, that you're telling us:
If the system needs something you attempt to emerge, it will build it regardless of the USE flags just to insure that the app functions properly. Is this a correct understanding on my part?
I believe I found under 2005.0 that including USE=docs created some interesting problems. Once i eliminated that flag, I seemed to have a much cleaner build. There are times, however, that I wish I had more documentation on that which I've emerged (Perhaps I need to add that flag to individual ebuilds to get the most of that which I desire).
Is this some of what you're trying to state? As an example, I could only get KDE to work by adding the explicit use flag of "USE=dlloader" (I picked this one up after studying forums - nope, no bug in KDE - but, dlloader should be a dependancy since those without knowledge of dlloader seemed to be the ones with problems - such as myself.)
However, you're also talking about package.use. When I read those tutorials, it made this Noobies eyes roll over. I just couldn't quite grasp the elegant difference between make.use and package.use.
Correct my if I'm wrong, but, adding a specific USE flag to a specific application such as:
| Code: | | #USE="dlloader" emerge KDE |
could also be corrected in package.use(?)
Am I starting to understand this, or, do you need to kick me in the butt some more?
Thanx
_________________
There is no higher religion than human service.
To work for the common good is the highest creed.
-Albert Schweitzer |
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lnthai2002
Apprentice
Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 260
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 3:39 pm Post subject: |
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To 6thpink
I know that setting the FLAGS in /etc/make.conf does have effect on whether or not a package will be install (qt or -qt, the qt package will be install anyway when you emerge kde). However, let say when you emerge cups, the source code of cups has a code fragment that use qt to make it run more efficient. If the -qt flag is set in make.conf, that code fragment is not compiled into the cups binary file. Thus, cups run "less" efficient. And putting qt in /etc/make.conf make the portage use the qt code fragment in the compilation process for cups. Correct me if i am wrong. However, this is not what i want to ask. My question is since both qt and gtk were installed on my computer when i install kde, what flag should i set , qt or gtk to make all of my program run efficiently? As far a si know, qt is not "native" to gnome, so it is not "loaded by default" in a gnome system. Thus, using qt in gnome is redundan since the system must switch from gtk to qt inorder to run a application that has qt support.
In addition, what is motif? Some application use motif instead of gtk. Is motif "more native" to kde than gtk?
Thanks for the info |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:19 pm Post subject: |
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| kpep01 wrote: |
As a result, the last time I bootstrapped my system (yes, it takes some time to learn how to bootstrap according to taste and work out self-inflicted bugs) I set the USE flags to -gnome -gtk -gtk2. It was my feeling at the moment that I prefered KDE, and I wanted to keep my system as light as possible.
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Ummh! "self-inflicted bugs"... I like that phrase. 
| Quote: | I've noticed, however, that when emerging KDE - as well as latter applications - that parts of Gnome are required dependancies. At least, the way I see what is happening make this appear true.
Sometimes, I've wondered if I screwed myself.
It appears, however, that you're telling us:
If the system needs something you attempt to emerge, it will build it regardless of the USE flags just to insure that the app functions properly. Is this a correct understanding on my part?
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Yes. For example, let's take a look into any kde application:
| Code: |
└─[50]-> # emerge -pv --nodeps kicker
These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild R ] kde-base/kicker-3.5.0 -arts -debug +kdeenablefinal +kdexdeltas -xcomposite -xinerama 0 kB
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As you see, in this package there are no "qt kde" flags, because kicker assumes that you need qt and kdelibs to install it. If you want kicker, then you want kdelibs and qt installed, and there is no word about that.
A gtk example:
| Code: |
└─[51]-> # emerge -pv --nodeps gimp
These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild R ] media-gfx/gimp-2.2.8-r1 -aalib (-altivec) -debug -doc +gimpprint -gtkhtml -hardened +jpeg +lcms -mmx +mng +png -python -smp +sse +svg +tiff +wmf 0 kB
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Same applies for this. You cant just turn "-gnome -gtk -gtk2" for The GImp, since it just needs these components and will install them regardless of your feelings about the gtk libraries 
If in some point in the future the Gimp developers decide to port it to qt then we would get something like this (this is a fictional emerge command, dont take it seriously):
| Code: |
└─[51]-> # emerge -pv --nodeps gimp
These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild R ] media-gfx/gimp-5.0_alpha1 +qt +gtk2 -aalib (-altivec) -debug -doc +gimpprint -gtkhtml -hardened +jpeg +lcms -mmx +mng +png -python -smp +sse +svg +tiff +wmf 1.2 gB
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This would be a hipothetical The GImp version with support for qt and gtk, in this supposed case you would be able to disable one of the toolkits, and the Gimp would only be built against the libraries that you want to use as your default toolkit (or again boths if you preffer that).
| Quote: |
I believe I found under 2005.0 that including USE=docs created some interesting problems. Once i eliminated that flag, I seemed to have a much cleaner build. There are times, however, that I wish I had more documentation on that which I've emerged (Perhaps I need to add that flag to individual ebuilds to get the most of that which I desire).
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The purpose of that flag is so different depending on the package. On most packages you just get aditional developer documentation (which is no use at all for the end user). In some others (overall development libs) it is used to install aditional source code examples, which are also useless for the average user. So, your best bet is to use it in a per-package basis. If you want something more for a package just emerge it with that flag.
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Is this some of what you're trying to state? As an example, I could only get KDE to work by adding the explicit use flag of "USE=dlloader" (I picked this one up after studying forums - nope, no bug in KDE - but, dlloader should be a dependancy since those without knowledge of dlloader seemed to be the ones with problems - such as myself.)
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It can be needed under some circumstances, but it is in no way required to run kde (I can tell you for sure). Anyway, kde does not use that flag at all (the only package into my system that supports that flag is
| Code: |
[ebuild R ] media-video/nvidia-glx-1.0.8178 -dlloader 0 kB
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This problems are not directly related to kde, but to the xorg version/build that you use and to the use of externally compiled drivers, like the nvidia one.
| Quote: |
However, you're also talking about package.use. When I read those tutorials, it made this Noobies eyes roll over. I just couldn't quite grasp the elegant difference between make.use and package.use.
Correct my if I'm wrong, but, adding a specific USE flag to a specific application such as:
| Code: | | #USE="dlloader" emerge KDE |
could also be corrected in package.use(?)
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True. It is far more elegant. My policy is, if I need something globally (and by globally I mean in every single package that supports it then I put it into the global settings, in the use varible into make.conf. Otherwise, I disable the feature into make.conf and enable it for single packages using the /etc/portage/package.use file.
For example:
| Code: |
#This is from make.conf, an extract from my USE.
USE="X -Xaw3d -kde -qt -gtk -gtk2 -gnome -motif -tcltk"
#This is from /etc/portage/package.use
#As you see the sintax is very similar to this into
#package.keywords or package,unmask
www-client/opera qt
app-text/poppler-bindings qt
x11-wm/fvwm gtk2
net-libs/wvstreams -oggvorbis -speex -vorbis
media-gfx/gimp -mmx gimpprint
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Those are some examples. In make.conf I disable the support for all the toolkits where it is optional. This does not affect the qt and gtk programs because they will use their toolkit anyway. Then I add it only to the programs where I need it. For example, I add the qt support to opera to be able to use the kde styles into the opera menus. The poppler stuff is used to render pdf files in kpdf, but does need to be built with qt support, otherwise poppler and kpdf will not compile ok. The gtk2 support is needed into fvwm to manage xft fonts properly. I also remove things that I have activated globally, like the media codecs, I don't need them into wvstreams (since I use that lib only into wvdial (a dialup program for modems). And I use -mmx for gimp, since that flag used to break the gimp compilation under most circumstances (haven't checked recently).
I hope I cleared up a bit what the differences between the two ways of setting USEs are.  |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 5:32 pm Post subject: |
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| lnthai2002 wrote: | To 6thpink
I know that setting the FLAGS in /etc/make.conf does have effect on whether or not a package will be install (qt or -qt, the qt package will be install anyway when you emerge kde). However, let say when you emerge cups, the source code of cups has a code fragment that use qt to make it run more efficient. If the -qt flag is set in make.conf, that code fragment is not compiled into the cups binary file. Thus, cups run "less" efficient. And putting qt in /etc/make.conf make the portage use the qt code fragment in the compilation process for cups. Correct me if i am wrong.
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I am not familiar with the cups sources, but I dont think that that is even possible. Flags control what part of the code are compiled usually by passing arguments (like for example --whitout-arts) to the ./configure script. If there is no flag, then there is no argument and there is no configuration change. Cups has no qt flag, and as such, the qt support is always compiled at least under net-print/cups-1.1.23-r7 that I am using.
| Quote: |
However, this is not what i want to ask. My question is since both qt and gtk were installed on my computer when i install kde, what flag should i set , qt or gtk to make all of my program run efficiently? As far a si know, qt is not "native" to gnome, so it is not "loaded by default" in a gnome system. Thus, using qt in gnome is redundan since the system must switch from gtk to qt inorder to run a application that has qt support.
In addition, what is motif? Some application use motif instead of gtk. Is motif "more native" to kde than gtk?
Thanks for the info |
Well: qt, gtk+/1/2, motif, fltk, Xaw3d and many others are different toolkits, AKA widgets libraries. Kde is built in base to a widget library called QT, maintained by an enterprise called TrollTech, Gnome is based over GTK, which is the Gimp ToolKit, Xaw3d is the classic X-Athena Widget library set, and fltk and motif are different implementations of standard widgets sets for X windows-like systems.
So, none of the Xaw, fltk or motif widgets are native for gnome or kde. Your kde programs will run efecienly regardless of the other widgets libraries that you install. They will just use qt, and let the other programs use their respective widget set without any problem. In other words, if you do a "emerge -pv whatever" and the flag that you are looking for is not into the flags list of that package, then that flags does not affect that package in any way, may it be set on or off.
So, gtk and motif are equally native under kde. There is no harm in running gtk applications under kde (and no, they do not start slower, that are myths). Gtk applications start the same in gnome and in kde. QT applications starts the same under gnome and kde, and works the same also. There is only one "but" on the kde applications. Most of them use a thing called dcop, which is not up when using gnome, so, when you start the first kde app under gnome it might take a bit more to load, but not for the app itself, but because the dcopserver is raising. Once it is up, kde applications works the same as in kde. |
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kpep01
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Seattle Area, WA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:14 pm Post subject: |
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Thanx for the two great answers, 6thpink. They were both most helpful for myself.
In your answer to lnthai2002, you must have anticipated my next question, as you mentioned using the code:
| Code: | | # emerge -pv whatever |
I've been having a few tweaky problems with X, so I did precisely that command and discovered the following:
| Code: | # emerge -pv xorg-x11
These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild R ] x11-base/xorg-x11-6.8.2-r6 -3dfx -3dnow +bitmap-fonts -cjk -debug -dlloader* -dmx -doc -font-server -insecure-drivers +ipv6 -minimal -mmx +nls -nocxx +opengl +pam -sdk -sse -static +truetype-fonts +type1-fonts (-uclibc) -xprint +xv 0 kB
Total size of downloads: 0 kB |
Based upon what you said earlier in your response to myself, I noted with interested the entry
It would appear to myself (nOOb that I am) that the asterix indicates that I really did want dlloader in xorg-x11. This would have prevented my having to add it to kde in order to get it (kde) to compile correctly. It would further appear to this nOOb that, since dlloader was not included in the xorg-x11 build, that it cuts down on my system efficiency. (Sadly, I was unable to find a description of dlloader either in the online documentation, nor in /usr/portage/profiles/use.desc.)
Regardless, it seems that a better study of use flags and their functions would be in order.
It would seem further that I might benefit somewhat in remerging xorg-x11 by adding the dlloader flag - perhaps it might help rid myself of a couple of quirks and erratic behaviours of X.
In remerging, however, would that change the config files that I have set to optimize my monitor and mouse functions?
Thanx
_________________
There is no higher religion than human service.
To work for the common good is the highest creed.
-Albert Schweitzer |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| kpep01 wrote: |
| Code: | # emerge -pv xorg-x11
These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild R ] x11-base/xorg-x11-6.8.2-r6 -3dfx -3dnow +bitmap-fonts -cjk -debug -dlloader* -dmx -doc -font-server -insecure-drivers +ipv6 -minimal -mmx +nls -nocxx +opengl +pam -sdk -sse -static +truetype-fonts +type1-fonts (-uclibc) -xprint +xv 0 kB
Total size of downloads: 0 kB |
Based upon what you said earlier in your response to myself, I noted with interested the entry
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That means that the dlloader support is actually compiled on xorg-x11 (you had it on the last time that you emerged xorg-x11, but that, if you compile it now, it is going to be disabled. The * means that this flag is changing now. So, if you have "-dlloader*" it means "it is active but if you compile now I am going to deactivate it" and "+dlloader*" would just mean "it is unactive, but if you compile now I will activate that feature". Talking plain: right now you have dlloader support on, but the use flag is off.
| Quote: |
It would appear to myself (nOOb that I am) that the asterix indicates that I really did want dlloader in xorg-x11. This would have prevented my having to add it to kde in order to get it (kde) to compile correctly. It would further appear to this nOOb that, since dlloader was not included in the xorg-x11 build, that it cuts down on my system efficiency. (Sadly, I was unable to find a description of dlloader either in the online documentation, nor in /usr/portage/profiles/use.desc.)
Regardless, it seems that a better study of use flags and their functions would be in order.
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I never had the need to use the dinamic module loader, but it might just be related to the use of external modules that are not in elf format. The only external module that I ever used related to x is the nvidia-glx driver, and seems to work ok with the standard elf loader for me.
| Quote: |
It would seem further that I might benefit somewhat in remerging xorg-x11 by adding the dlloader flag - perhaps it might help rid myself of a couple of quirks and erratic behaviours of X.
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I dont know if that will help. If you feel brave just try it, remember to do a "emerge -puDvN world" to make sure that any other package whose use flags are changed will also be recompiled, other way the result can be a bit weird.
By the way, I nice place to get info on package and use flags is www.gentoo-portage.com
Just search for a package, click on it and go bottom, then select use flags or whatever you want to know about that package.
EDIT:
| Quote: |
In remerging, however, would that change the config files that I have set to optimize my monitor and mouse functions?
Thanx |
No, its not related. |
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kpep01
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Seattle Area, WA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 8:57 pm Post subject: |
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6thpink wrote:
| Quote: | By the way, I nice place to get info on package and use flags is www.gentoo-portage.com
Just search for a package, click on it and go bottom, then select use flags or whatever you want to know about that package. |
That's a fun one that I hadn't seen before. Sure beats the hell out of viewing the CVS, then doing emerge -s whatever to figure out what the application is all about. Not only that, but, clicking on a specific USE flag gives some more interesting information.
Thanx again.
_________________
There is no higher religion than human service.
To work for the common good is the highest creed.
-Albert Schweitzer |
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firephoto
Veteran
Joined: 29 Oct 2003
Posts: 1612
Location: +48° 5' 23.40", -119° 48' 30.00"
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 9:04 pm Post subject: |
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If you want good tweaked use flags use the split kde builds and don't emerge kuickshow (has old gtk1 deps) since that's probably where your gnome or extra gtk stuff came from. If you install firefox use the firefox-bin and it should have a few less deps from the "g" side of the fence.
Here's my use flags from make.conf
| Code: |
USE="font-server truetype-fonts type1-fonts
3dnow
aac -aalib acpi alsa -apache2 arts artswrappersuid asf audiofile avi
bash-completion bitmap-fonts -bonobo
cdparanoia cdr cjk -cpudetection crypt css cups curl
-dar32 -dar64 dga -directfb dlloader dri dv dvd dvdr
-eds -emacs -emacs-w3 encode -esd exif
fastcgi ffmpeg flac flash foomaticdb
gd gdbm geoip ggi gif -gnome gphoto2 gps -gstreamer -gtk -gtkhtml -guile
hal
ieee1394 imap imagemagick imlib -ipv6 -i8x0
jabber java jpeg -junit
kcal kde kdeenablefinal kipi kqemu
lcms -ldap libg++ libgda libwww logitech-mouse
mad -matrox mmx mmxext -motif -mozilla mpeg mplayer musicbrainz -mysql
-nas nodrm nomotif nptl nptlonly nsplugin
offensive openal openexr opengl -oss
pam ppds pdflib perl png -postgres python
qt quicktime
rdesktop readline real -ruby
samba scanner sdl slp -smime -snmp softmmu speex spell sse sse2 ssl svg svga symlink
tcltk -tetex tscd theora tidy tiff truetype
unicode userlocales usb
vorbis
win32codecs wmf
X xine xinerama xml xml2 -xmms xprint xv xvid -xvmc
yv12
zeroconf zlib"
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My relevant /etc/portage/package.use entries
| Code: |
dev-python/wxpython gtk2
net-www/mplayerplug-in -gtk2
x11-misc/xscreensaver -gtk2
dev-util/kdevelop -java
media-video/kmplayer -gstreamer
media-libs/freetype bindist
net-p2p/bittorrent gtk
app-text/xpdf -X
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There's other flags enabled too from emerged packages so here's my end result from my emerge info.
| Code: |
USE="x86 3dnow X aac acpi alsa apm arts artswrappersuid asf audiofile avi bash-completion berkdb bitmap-fonts bzip2 cdparanoia cdr cjk crypt css cups curl dga dlloader dri dv dvd dvdr emboss encode exif expat fam fastcgi ffmpeg flac flash font-server foomaticdb fortran gd gdbm geoip ggi gif glut gmp gphoto2 gpm gps gtk2 hal idn ieee1394 imagemagick imap imlib jabber java jpeg kcal kde kdeenablefinal kipi kqemu lcms libg++ libgda libwww logitech-mouse mad mikmod mmx mmxext mng mp3 mpeg mplayer musicbrainz ncurses nls nodrm nomotif nptl nptlonly nsplugin offensive ogg oggvorbis openal openexr opengl pam pcre pdflib perl png ppds python qt quicktime rdesktop readline real samba scanner sdl slp softmmu speex spell sqlite sse sse2 ssl svg svga symlink tcltk tcpd theora tidy tiff truetype truetype-fonts tscd type1-fonts udev unicode usb userlocales vorbis win32codecs wmf xine xinerama xml xml2 xprint xv xvid yv12 zeroconf zlib elibc_glibc kernel_linux userland_GNU"
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This isn't tweaked for mean and lean, it's tweaked for overall use, but it's pretty much the same as my p3-700 laptop use flags and it has no performance issues. A lot of the minused use flags are from old ones that were used at one time or to negate retarded make.default flags. There's some old ones that just aren't used anymore in there too I see. And yes that is how it looks in my make.conf file, separate lines for the most part sorted alphabetically, just make sure you have your first flags on the first line (USE="afoo ..) or it might cause issues with some gui frontends (kuroo).
The make.default flags you probably want to minus for a mostly pure kde system would be eds, gnome, gstreamer, gtk, gtk2 motif and xmms, and you can add them per package when needed in your package.use file.
Some of the kde flags used that might be desired are hal, zeroconf, musicbrainz and others but those are ones that aren't on by default.
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 9:33 pm Post subject: |
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| firephoto wrote: | If you want good tweaked use flags use the split kde builds and don't emerge kuickshow (has old gtk1 deps) since that's probably where your gnome or extra gtk stuff came from. If you install firefox use the firefox-bin and it should have a few less deps from the "g" side of the fence.
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Nice catch, my personal "dont-touch" apps in kde are kuickshow, kview, noatun, kboodle, arts and many others. Those ones specially, force the installation of a lot of packages. |
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kpep01
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Seattle Area, WA
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 10:08 pm Post subject: |
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Thanx for the additional input, firephoto. It's definately food for thought. One question I have, though:
You stated:
| Quote: | | A lot of the minused use flags are from old ones that were used at one time or to negate retarded make.default flags. There's some old ones that just aren't used anymore in there too I see |
My first attempts with Gentoo were with 2005.0. When I did my first build with 2005.1, I simply used my old notes to create my make.conf file and use flags. Perhaps I too have some old and unused USE flags in my make.conf. I'll take it that I might want to review the latest USE flag lists and clean things up a bit?
Thanx all for the education on such matters.
_________________
There is no higher religion than human service.
To work for the common good is the highest creed.
-Albert Schweitzer |
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tuam
l33t
Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 765
Location: CGN, Germany
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| Posted: Sat Jan 14, 2006 10:50 pm Post subject: |
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| kpep01 wrote: |
It would further appear to this nOOb that, since dlloader was not included in the xorg-x11 build, that it cuts down on my system efficiency.
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USE flags are not necessarily for "efficiency". Often, activating one will activate an optional feature (e.g. codecs in video players), which means more compiled code -> a bigger binary. I would not expect a difference in execution time of the program.
FF,
Daniel |
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lnthai2002
Apprentice
Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 260
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| Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 4:23 pm Post subject: |
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| firephoto wrote: | | If you want good tweaked use flags use the split kde builds and don't emerge kuickshow (has old gtk1 deps) since that's probably where your gnome or extra gtk stuff came from. |
According to the gentoo-portage.com, kuickshow doesn't depend on gtk.
How do you know that there are some "gnome" packages in your system? If i know the name of the "gnome" package installed, how can i check which packages are using these "gnome" package?
Thanks |
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firephoto
Veteran
Joined: 29 Oct 2003
Posts: 1612
Location: +48° 5' 23.40", -119° 48' 30.00"
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| Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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| lnthai2002 wrote: |
According to the gentoo-portage.com, kuickshow doesn't depend on gtk. |
imlib -1 and gtk+-1 get pulled in.
| Code: |
# emerge kuickshow -vpD
These are the packages that I would merge, in order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild NS ] x11-libs/gtk+-1.2.10-r11 USE="nls -debug" 0 kB
[ebuild N ] media-libs/imlib-1.9.14-r3 0 kB
[ebuild N ] kde-base/kuickshow-3.5.0 USE="arts kdeenablefinal xinerama -debug -kdexdeltas" 0 kB
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| Quote: | | How do you know that there are some "gnome" packages in your system? |
| Code: |
# ls /var/db/pkg/gnome-*/
/var/db/pkg/gnome-base/:
libglade-2.5.1
/var/db/pkg/gnome-extra/:
libgsf-1.13.3
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| Quote: | If i know the name of the "gnome" package installed, how can i check which packages are using these "gnome" package?
Thanks |
| Code: |
# equery depends libglade
[ Searching for packages depending on libglade... ]
sys-devel/distcc-2.18.3-r7
dev-python/pygtk-2.8.2
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equery is from the gentoolkit package.
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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| lnthai2002 wrote: | | firephoto wrote: | | If you want good tweaked use flags use the split kde builds and don't emerge kuickshow (has old gtk1 deps) since that's probably where your gnome or extra gtk stuff came from. |
According to the gentoo-portage.com, kuickshow doesn't depend on gtk.
How do you know that there are some "gnome" packages in your system? If i know the name of the "gnome" package installed, how can i check which packages are using these "gnome" package?
Thanks |
The easier way is to use just emerge.
| Code: |
┌─(dom ene 15, 18:43:26)-(root@localhost)-(/home/i92guboj)-·
└─[18]-> # emerge -pevt kuickshow
These are the packages that I would merge, in reverse order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild N ] kde-base/kuickshow-3.4.1 -arts -debug +kdeenablefinal +kdexdeltas -xinerama 0 kB
[ebuild N ] media-libs/imlib-1.9.14-r3 0 kB
[ebuild N ] media-libs/giflib-4.1.4 +X -rle 0 kB
[ebuild N ] x11-libs/gtk+-1.2.10-r11 -debug +nls 0 kB
[ebuild N ] dev-util/intltool-0.34.1 0 kB
[ebuild N ] dev-perl/XML-Parser-2.34 0 kB
[ebuild N ] dev-util/xdelta-1.1.3 0 kB
[ebuild N ] dev-libs/glib-1.2.10-r5 -hardened 0 kB
[ebuild N ] kde-base/kdelibs-3.4.3 +alsa -arts +cups -debug -doc -jpeg2k +kdeenablefinal -kerberos -openexr +spell +ssl +tiff -xinerama -zeroconf 16,482 kB
[ebuild N ] app-text/ghostscript-esp-7.07.1-r8 +X -cjk +cups -emacs -gtk 0 kB
[ebuild N ] media-fonts/gnu-gs-fonts-std-8.11 0 kB
[ebuild N ] x11-base/xorg-x11-7.0 -3dfx +xprint 0 kB
[ebuild N ] x11-libs/libXv-1.0.1 0 kB
[ebuild N ] x11-apps/xmodmap-1.0.0 0 kB
................................
<one million lines cuted from here>
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As you can see, it needs imlib, and imlib pushes gtk1 and some other stuff. Very bad, Kuickshow!  |
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lnthai2002
Apprentice
Joined: 04 Nov 2005
Posts: 260
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:13 am Post subject: |
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Well, i tried to remove kuickshow :
| Code: | | emerge --unmerge kuickshow |
then clean up the portage tree:
and i saw only imlib was removed !!!
Supprisingly, when i check the gnome packages on my system
| Code: | | ls /var/db/pkg/gnome-*/ |
I end up with only 2 packages:
gconf and gstream(i dont remember the correct name of the gs.. since i am on centOS)
So, why do everyone say that kuicker make gtk+ installed?
More supprise, emerge -p gtk+ inform that gtk+ has already installed!!!
So the question is: why gtk+ installed but it is not detected as gnome packages? When i install kuicker, it take damn long time (up to 10 packages were installed) but when i remove it, only a few were removed!!! Is there any replacement for kquicker that only use qt?
Is motif better than gtk?
Thai |
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firephoto
Veteran
Joined: 29 Oct 2003
Posts: 1612
Location: +48° 5' 23.40", -119° 48' 30.00"
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:16 am Post subject: |
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I'm using gwenview now instead of kuickshow for image viewing.
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:52 am Post subject: |
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| lnthai2002 wrote: | Well, i tried to remove kuickshow :
| Code: | | emerge --unmerge kuickshow |
then clean up the portage tree:
and i saw only imlib was removed !!!
Supprisingly, when i check the gnome packages on my system
| Code: | | ls /var/db/pkg/gnome-*/ |
I end up with only 2 packages:
gconf and gstream(i dont remember the correct name of the gs.. since i am on centOS)
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Not strange, since gtk is not under gnome-base or gnome-extras, but under x11-libs. It is not a gnome package, it is a tookit, exactly the Gimp ToolKit (thus the GTK thing). Gnome needs gtk as need also x11, but gtk and x11 are not gnome packages.
| Quote: |
So, why do everyone say that kuicker make gtk+ installed?
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And it does, haven't you seen this on my prev post?
EDIT: When you say "kuicker" I assume that you mean "kuickshow".
| Code: |
┌─(dom ene 15, 18:43:26)-(root@localhost)-(/home/i92guboj)-·
└─[18]-> # emerge -pevt kuickshow
These are the packages that I would merge, in reverse order:
Calculating dependencies ...done!
[ebuild N ] kde-base/kuickshow-3.4.1 -arts -debug +kdeenablefinal +kdexdeltas -xinerama 0 kB
[ebuild N ] media-libs/imlib-1.9.14-r3 0 kB
[ebuild N ] media-libs/giflib-4.1.4 +X -rle 0 kB
[ebuild N ] x11-libs/gtk+-1.2.10-r11 -debug +nls 0 kB
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As you see, kuickshow requires imlib and imlib requires gtk1. So, kuickshow requires gtk1. It is a matematical property, which I dont know how it is named in english. You know, if A->B and B->C then A->C.
| Quote: |
More supprise, emerge -p gtk+ inform that gtk+ has already installed!!!
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Ok, the fact that kuickshow requires gtk does not mean that unistalling kuichshow you will not need gtk, because (surprise) there are more gtk programs in the world. Concretely, some very used programs that uses gtk1 are gmplayer and xmms. If you have one of these then you know why is gtk1 there, if not, then there should be any other gtk1 dependant app installed. |
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kpep01
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Seattle Area, WA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:15 am Post subject: |
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Danged, I have nothing to offer this thread, but, I can say I'm getting one hell of an education. Thanx.
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To work for the common good is the highest creed.
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kpep01
Tux's lil' helper
Joined: 20 Oct 2005
Posts: 96
Location: Seattle Area, WA
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 8:19 am Post subject: |
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6thpink wrote:
| Quote: | | As you see, kuickshow requires imlib and imlib requires gtk1. So, kuickshow requires gtk1. It is a matematical property, which I dont know how it is named in english. You know, if A->B and B->C then A->C. |
Your English is fine, and you explained the mathematical property just fine - according to any form of communication of which I'm aware
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There is no higher religion than human service.
To work for the common good is the highest creed.
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tuam
l33t
Joined: 04 May 2004
Posts: 765
Location: CGN, Germany
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 12:20 pm Post subject: |
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| 6thpink wrote: | As you see, kuickshow requires imlib and imlib requires gtk1. So, kuickshow requires gtk1. It is a matematical property, which I dont know how it is named in english. You know, if A->B and B->C then A->C.
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<mode="what is the name for he-who-knows-everything-better-in-class?">
transitivity 
</mode> |
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i92guboj
Bodhisattva
Joined: 30 Nov 2004
Posts: 10315
Location: Córdoba (Spain)
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| Posted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 6:42 pm Post subject: |
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| tuam wrote: | | 6thpink wrote: | As you see, kuickshow requires imlib and imlib requires gtk1. So, kuickshow requires gtk1. It is a matematical property, which I dont know how it is named in english. You know, if A->B and B->C then A->C.
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<mode="what is the name for he-who-knows-everything-better-in-class?">
transitivity
</mode> |
Thanks, in my language it is "propiedad transitiva", which literally would be "transitive property". It is always cool to learn something new. |
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tSp
Apprentice
Joined: 19 Jan 2004
Posts: 214
Location: Maysville, KY
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| Posted: Sun Jan 20, 2008 4:20 am Post subject: |
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I just wanted to comment with this piece of useful gibberish: I have been using gentoo for several years now, and linux much longer. I can't remember what all of the use flags do, so this tip may help to also learn about the use flags:
This requires gentoolkit to be installed, so if its not, emerge it:
| Code: | | emerge -v gentoolkit |
Next, see the man page for euse:
Here is the tip about use flags for you: If you don't know what a use flag is for, then use this command:
replace use_flag above with whatever use flag you want to know about. Next is an example:
| Code: | euse -i ipod
global use flags (searching: ipod)
************************************************************
[+ C ] ipod - Enable support for iPod device access
local use flags (searching: ipod)
************************************************************
no matching entries found |
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tSp
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