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polle
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 Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 1:16 pm Post subject: beryl and e17 |
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I now use kde on my gentoo, installed beryl and everything ok (graphics nvidia 6200TC)
I would like to try e17 as well,
Is it possible to install both? I don't think I can use e17 with beryl but that's not he point, I want at the kdm login to choose between kde and e17, and when I run kde to use beryl.
running e17 alone when I choose e17
If someone has done this before I would be pleased to hear |
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nesl247
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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| Just follow http://wiki.gentoo-xeffects.org/Beryl .. KDM will load KDE and you will get beryl. e17 will load if KDM is set to load it... It's as simple as that. |
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polle
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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beryl is already installed that's not the problem. But googling about e17 and beryl Ifound some writings about conflicting installing both, but it wasn't very clear if it was true or not, because no details were given;
So I would like to hear if someone installed both beryl and e17 without problems or if there were, how they were solved |
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nesl247
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| Posted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 2:55 pm Post subject: |
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| There CANNOT be any conflicts in installing them both.. They have completely different filenames, so it's not like one overwrite the other.. Those people had meant that you cannot RUN them both at the same time. |
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Frelon
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:23 pm Post subject: |
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You can run another XServer with another wm 
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erikm
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| Posted: Mon Jan 15, 2007 12:38 pm Post subject: |
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| polle wrote: | beryl is already installed that's not the problem. But googling about e17 and beryl Ifound some writings about conflicting installing both, but it wasn't very clear if it was true or not, because no details were given;
So I would like to hear if someone installed both beryl and e17 without problems or if there were, how they were solved |
There is per se no 'conflict' between the two, as in the one having to be removed for the other to be installed.
E17 will not run with Beryl, however. That is, you cannot start E17 and have beryl replace e. Too bad, IMHO, as the beryl eyecandy paired with the amazing Enlightenment interface would be quite the sight for sore eyes... |
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polle
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| Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 9:57 am Post subject: |
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thanks all, just installed e17, looks very promising, still learning how to configure it, (using this, aleady got me going: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_emerge_e17)
I read that e17 also supports real transparency, but still didn't find how to turn it on |
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gimpel
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| Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 10:12 am Post subject: |
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| polle wrote: | thanks all, just installed e17, looks very promising, still learning how to configure it, (using this, aleady got me going: http://gentoo-wiki.com/HOWTO_emerge_e17)
I read that e17 also supports real transparency, but still didn't find how to turn it on |
Look at the modules, they are fully transparent, also shelves can be transparent.
Further reading: http://www1.get-e.org/Main/FAQs/#41
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polle
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| Posted: Tue Jan 16, 2007 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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Okay, searching I found that elucence could be the solution; there is even an ebuild, I have installed third party ebuilds before, but I don't know in which subdirectory I have to put he ebuild in, must be a subdirectory of usr/local/portage/.....
you find a litle more about he ebuild here:
http://edevelop.org/node/2394 |
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TheCoop
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| Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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| erikm wrote: | | polle wrote: | beryl is already installed that's not the problem. But googling about e17 and beryl Ifound some writings about conflicting installing both, but it wasn't very clear if it was true or not, because no details were given;
So I would like to hear if someone installed both beryl and e17 without problems or if there were, how they were solved |
There is per se no 'conflict' between the two, as in the one having to be removed for the other to be installed.
E17 will not run with Beryl, however. That is, you cannot start E17 and have beryl replace e. Too bad, IMHO, as the beryl eyecandy paired with the amazing Enlightenment interface would be quite the sight for sore eyes... |
any particular reasons why it is so? How easy would it be to get e17 running with beryl doing all beryl's fancy things and e doing the interface?
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sirdilznik
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| Posted: Sat Apr 07, 2007 3:24 pm Post subject: |
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| TheCoop wrote: | | erikm wrote: | | polle wrote: | beryl is already installed that's not the problem. But googling about e17 and beryl Ifound some writings about conflicting installing both, but it wasn't very clear if it was true or not, because no details were given;
So I would like to hear if someone installed both beryl and e17 without problems or if there were, how they were solved |
There is per se no 'conflict' between the two, as in the one having to be removed for the other to be installed.
E17 will not run with Beryl, however. That is, you cannot start E17 and have beryl replace e. Too bad, IMHO, as the beryl eyecandy paired with the amazing Enlightenment interface would be quite the sight for sore eyes... |
any particular reasons why it is so? How easy would it be to get e17 running with beryl doing all beryl's fancy things and e doing the interface? |
I haven't run beryl in a LONG time, so maybe things have changed, but last time I checked it only ran on a couple different WMs. E17 can only run on its own WM. Thus you can't have both running at the same time. Someone correct me if this has changed and I'm wrong. |
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gimpel
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 12:27 am Post subject: |
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| TheCoop wrote: | | erikm wrote: | | polle wrote: | beryl is already installed that's not the problem. But googling about e17 and beryl Ifound some writings about conflicting installing both, but it wasn't very clear if it was true or not, because no details were given;
So I would like to hear if someone installed both beryl and e17 without problems or if there were, how they were solved |
There is per se no 'conflict' between the two, as in the one having to be removed for the other to be installed.
E17 will not run with Beryl, however. That is, you cannot start E17 and have beryl replace e. Too bad, IMHO, as the beryl eyecandy paired with the amazing Enlightenment interface would be quite the sight for sore eyes... |
any particular reasons why it is so? |
Because both are window managers. That's like with cars, you can't drive two at a time 
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geniux
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 12:49 am Post subject: |
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| sirdilznik wrote: |
E17 can only run on its own WM |
No, E17 is a WM not a DE
And as already said, you can only run one WM at the time
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sirdilznik
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 12:53 am Post subject: |
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| geniux wrote: | | sirdilznik wrote: |
E17 can only run on its own WM |
No, E17 is a WM not a DE
And as already said, you can only run one WM at the time |
According to the designers or E17 it's neither a DE nor a WM, but a Desktop Shell
But we're just nitpicking here.  |
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geniux
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| Posted: Sun Apr 08, 2007 12:59 am Post subject: |
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| sirdilznik wrote: |
According to the designers or E17 it's neither a DE nor a WM, but a Desktop Shell
But we're just nitpicking here. |
That I haven't read, thanks for the info
So we have DE, WM and DS then
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VanDan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 3:01 am Post subject: |
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There is some hope for people wanting beryl-type effects in E17.
Firstly, there's the Bang! module:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1067110727577498167
It's not released yet.
Next, there is the egloo module:
http://mtreny.free.fr/egloo/
It's also not released yet, but there is some code there ... that doesn't work. But the videos look equally as impressive as the Bang! module. So I'd say in the next couple of months we'll see some OpenGL-composited goodness appearing in E17. I'm waiting anyway ...
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gimpel
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 8:09 am Post subject: |
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| VanDan wrote: | There is some hope for people wanting beryl-type effects in E17.
Firstly, there's the Bang! module:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-1067110727577498167
It's not released yet.
Next, there is the egloo module:
http://mtreny.free.fr/egloo/
It's also not released yet, but there is some code there ... that doesn't work. But the videos look equally as impressive as the Bang! module. So I'd say in the next couple of months we'll see some OpenGL-composited goodness appearing in E17. I'm waiting anyway ... |
There is also the bling module, available in CVS. (e_modules-bling in the overlay)
egloo does work here, but causes segfaults on restart. Though the code there is outdated and not supposed to work (though it does here). Damn, I love that mosaic feature, this is such a great usability++ - they should integrate that in bling, or Simon should release egloo (or at least update his backup on his webspace  )
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zxy
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 12:32 pm Post subject: |
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and a video of bling in action if anybody is interrested:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZovBpvhZbZM
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VanDan
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| Posted: Wed Apr 25, 2007 11:58 pm Post subject: |
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| gimpel wrote: | | egloo does work here, but causes segfaults on restart. |
Damn! Really? I get:
| Code: | | /home/dan/.e/e/modules/egloo/linux-gnu-x86_64/module.so: undefined symbol: glXReleaseTexImageEXT |
when I try to load the module ( enlightenment_remote -module-load egloo ).
Don't suppose anyone knows how to fix this?
| gimpel wrote: | | Damn, I love that mosaic feature, this is such a great usability++ - they should integrate that in bling |
I don't think you'll get that with traditional compositors - you need an OpenGL one.
| gimpel wrote: | | or Simon should release egloo (or at least update his backup on his webspace ) |
I'm with you on that one
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gimpel
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| Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 10:21 am Post subject: |
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| VanDan wrote: | | gimpel wrote: | | egloo does work here, but causes segfaults on restart. |
Damn! Really? I get:
| Code: | | /home/dan/.e/e/modules/egloo/linux-gnu-x86_64/module.so: undefined symbol: glXReleaseTexImageEXT |
when I try to load the module ( enlightenment_remote -module-load egloo ).
Don't suppose anyone knows how to fix this?
| gimpel wrote: | | Damn, I love that mosaic feature, this is such a great usability++ - they should integrate that in bling |
I don't think you'll get that with traditional compositors - you need an OpenGL one. | gimpel wrote: | | or Simon should release egloo (or at least update his backup on his webspace ) |
I'm with you on that one |
Hmm, I compiled it after switching to xorg-x11 opengl interface. After compile finished, I switched back to nvidia's.
Standard Xorg + composite extension here. Nvidia is configured to use ARGBGLXVisuals.
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VanDan
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| Posted: Thu Apr 26, 2007 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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| gimpel wrote: | Hmm, I compiled it after switching to xorg-x11 opengl interface. After compile finished, I switched back to nvidia's.
Standard Xorg + composite extension here. Nvidia is configured to use ARGBGLXVisuals. |
Yeah I built it with xorg-x11 and continue to use it ( r300 ). I've tried with mesa-6.5.3 from git and also 6.5.2 from portage. Not only that, but I haven't actually had any other drivers on this system ( ie never installed ATI's drivers since the last re-install ).
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swingkyd
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 12:54 am Post subject: |
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| so if one had to choose between e17 and beryl...what would you choose? |
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VanDan
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| Posted: Fri Aug 31, 2007 1:24 am Post subject: |
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| swingkyd wrote: | | so if one had to choose between e17 and beryl...what would you choose? |
The Beryl project has been merged back into 'Compiz Fusion'. They've made an initial release, and there are plenty of reasons for upgrading from Beryl to Compiz Fusion if you're already using Beryl.
As for whether I'd use E17 or Compiz Fusion, the choice is pretty clear for me now: Compiz Fusion. E17 is unstable in multiple ways. To start with, there's just good old-fashioned crashing. It didn't used to do this, but recently ( last 3 months or so ), it's become quite painful, and it doesn't just crash and restart - it brings down the X server at the same time  Then there's the constantly-changing-everything drive. If you update E17, chances are you'll loose functionality. Things just keep breaking. Themes, backgrounds, modules, icons ... you name it, they break it. This is probably related to the fact that the E17 project doesn't really have any coherent aim, in terms of a final product, in sight. They openly admit this. They'll all happy to hack away in their own little corner, rewriting yet-another-virtual-filesystem or 1 of 3 file managers, converting dialogs to modules ( that need to be explicitly loaded before you can use the previously-always-available config dialgs ), or of course, rewriting evas yet again. Releasing E17 is not currently under consideration - there's still too many things to break and rewrite.
While evas & E17 libraries promised to deliver some actual hardware assisted ( or at least somewhat software accelerated ) rendering, this is still a pipedream that no-one wants to talk about ( seriously - rock up in the E17 mailing list and ask about using evas' OpenGL renderer to accelerate E17 ). We've got the software renderer, and XRENDER, which is slow and incomplete. There are partial implementations of all sorts of other things, from software-xcb to glitz ( which would be hardware accelerated via OpenGL if it worked ), to SDL ( Simple Direct Media Layer ), to OpenGL, to Cairo. But the point is that there is little interest in getting any of these off the ground.
Meanwhile, XGL / AIGLX -based GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap compositing has been surging ahead in leaps and bounds for over a year. While this has little to do with the initial rendering of stuff, it obviously delivers a mind-blowing array of visual effects in the post-rendering stage. The E17 team have basically said that they're not interested in this technology, because it's too unstable, and will consider implementing it for E18. Now keep in mind that E16 was released in 1999 - almost a decade ago, and that E17 has no release date on the horizon. So when do we expect E18? Not for a damned long time.
Finally, a couple of people have started working on a GLX_EXT_texture_from_pixmap compositor for E17 ( Bang! and Egloo modules ), but neither of them have released anything, and both of them have all but abandoned the projects.
So for me, I've got the choice between some bouncy, animated icons and backgrounds in E17 ( and I do like animated backgrounds - I've released several myself ), or hardware-accelerated compositing with bind-blowing effects for all applications. The choice is quite simple. I migrated by work desktop to Compiz Fusion when it was released, and then did my laptop, and now I'm doing the rest of our work desktops.
I still load up E17 occasionally, for example if a new theme / animated background is released, I'll check it out, just to satisfy my curiosity. And I'm even thinking about doing some more work on some of my animated backgrounds. But I don't see myself moving away from Compiz Fusion any time soon.
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Ariem
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 9:43 am Post subject: |
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And what do you run along with Compiz?
It would be nice to have it along e17, but that seems not to be a choice.. going for gnome/kde is "overloading" your pc.. a good reason I still use e17 (besides it's "good looks" - although that annoyance of re-configuring all over again after an update...). Other lightweight'ed WM don't fully satisfy what e17 gives me... so, what do you use? |
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VanDan
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| Posted: Mon Sep 03, 2007 10:45 am Post subject: |
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I just run Gnome & Compiz Fusion. Gnome doesn't exactly have a lot of bling, but it's useful and stable.
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